NIL

[rrlbees]

They won't do anything because they would have to investigate Texas A@M.
We know there were shenanigans there, but they won't touch the SEC or Big 10. The NCAA needs to go away.

Im not arguing whether they’ll do anything or not. I already said they have no balls.

 

[rrlbees]

Wildhack just did a presser about many subjects. One was NIL. I’ll trust John knows what he is talking about vs random posters.

 

[IthacaBarrel]

Wildhack just did a presser about many subjects. One was NIL. I’ll trust John knows what he is talking about vs random posters.

That's a pretty safe bet

 

[mscanlo]

Wildhack just did a presser about many subjects. One was NIL. I’ll trust John knows what he is talking about vs random posters.

only saw a summary, but looks like Wildhack said we will play by the rules. "We want to do it the right way. We’re not going to buy players, and we’re not supposed to do that." per Mike Curtis tweet

Issue is, even if everyone played by the rules (e.g. didn't provide NIL before a recruit is actually on the team), there is no limit to how large a NIL can be (and likely will never be limited).

Thus we are headed towards a small market vs. large market cap model. Hasn't really worked well in sports (e.g. MLB, English Premier League, etc.).

 

[Capt. Tuttle]

According to the article he certainly is getting paid to go to Miami. He’s agreed to the deal and turned down a bigger one from Florida. It’s exactly what the NCAA policy says to can’t do. Word for word.

Hey, if it's true NIL, sign both

 

[rrlbees]

only saw a summary, but looks like Wildhack said we will play by the rules. "We want to do it the right way. We’re not going to buy players, and we’re not supposed to do that." per Mike Curtis tweet

Issue is, even if everyone played by the rules (e.g. didn't provide NIL before a recruit is actually on the team), there is no limit to how large a NIL can be (and likely will never be limited).

Thus we are headed towards a small market vs. large market cap model. Hasn't really worked well in sports (e.g. MLB, English Premier League, etc.).

That is all true.

 

[SWC75]

only saw a summary, but looks like Wildhack said we will play by the rules. "We want to do it the right way. We’re not going to buy players, and we’re not supposed to do that." per Mike Curtis tweet

Issue is, even if everyone played by the rules (e.g. didn't provide NIL before a recruit is actually on the team), there is no limit to how large a NIL can be (and likely will never be limited).

Thus we are headed towards a small market vs. large market cap model. Hasn't really worked well in sports (e.g. MLB, English Premier League, etc.).

I still wonder if a small market player who is an A-list celebrity in that market could get as much or more than a B-C-D list celebrity in a larger market.

 

[Stern]

I honestly think the NIL system we see today will stay in place and nothing is going to change. Yes, rules are being broken left and right but I don't think anyone wants this fight.

It's like politics. Half of the people see it one way, while the other half see it the opposite way. Half see it as "hey they are just college kids making money, nothing wrong with that. This is America." Then you have the other half who raise red flags, and are 100% right in regards to this is killing all of college sports and the competitive balance, but they are painted as monsters because they are trying to take good money away from poor college kids who just have an opportunity to cash in.

I think the public outcry about this is from a small vocal minority and I'm not sure there is enough "will" with the powers that be to try to enforce rules and change the current system at the end of the day. They may talk a good game and say they do, but I don't believe they will follow through.

This is the new normal. College Athletic Departments and Programs will adjust, or they won't. If they don't they will be left behind in a pile of dust while the big schools just get bigger and spend more and more. Pretty much every school is out there trying to find a billionaire alum who loves sports so they can bankroll this thing. Some schools have that, others don't.

It is what it is and I really don't believe anyone cares to fight this fight really from everything I read and hear.

The old saying Lead, Follow, or Get Out of the Way. That 100% applies to the NIL/Recruiting/Transfer Portal and how it is being used in college sports. Don't waste time crying about it. Either lead, follow, or get out of the way.

 

[rrlbees]

I honestly think the NIL system we see today will stay in place and nothing is going to change. Yes, rules are being broken left and right but I don't think anyone wants this fight.

It's like politics. Half of the people see it one way, while the other half see it the opposite way. Half see it as "hey they are just college kids making money, nothing wrong with that. This is America." Then you have the other half who raise red flags, and are 100% right in regards to this is killing all of college sports and the competitive balance, but they are painted as monsters because they are trying to take good money away from poor college kids who just have an opportunity to cash in.

I think the public outcry about this is from a small vocal minority and I'm not sure there is enough "will" with the powers that be to try to enforce rules and change the current system at the end of the day. They may talk a good game and say they do, but I don't believe they will follow through.

This is the new normal. College Athletic Departments and Programs will adjust, or they won't. If they don't they will be left behind in a pile of dust while the big schools just get bigger and spend more and more. Pretty much every school is out there trying to find a billionaire alum who loves sports so they can bankroll this thing. Some schools have that, others don't.

It is what it is and I really don't believe anyone cares to fight this fight really from everything I read and hear.

The old saying Lead, Follow, or Get Uut of the Way. That 100% applies to the NIL/Recruiting/Transfer Portal and how it is being used in college sports. Don't waste time crying about it. Either lead, follow, or get out of the way.

They aren’t college kids….yet.

Oh, and if you aren’t part of the solution, you’re part of the problem.

 

[Stern]

They aren’t college kids….yet.

Oh, and if you aren’t part of the solution, you’re part of the problem.

We are on the same side of this issue. But I think we are in the minority in the big picture of public opinion. That was the point of my last post.

I don't think there is this big movement or groundswell of support to really correct this issue.

 

[baggerbob]

They aren’t college kids….yet.

Oh, and if you aren’t part of the solution, you’re part of the problem.

I agree there is a problem, but unless the big conferences break away from the NCAA, and set their own rules all the schools will do what they want.

 

[rrlbees]

We are on the same side of this issue. But I think we are in the minority in the big picture of public opinion. That was the point of my last post.

I don't think there is this big movement or groundswell of support to really correct this issue.

I don’t disagree and the reason IMO for the majority public opinion is ignorance. I’ve talked to so many people here and non board people and their knowledge of what NIL is and supposed to be per policy is slim. They can’t see where the line is drawn. Probably because the line is drawn with disappearing ink. At least for some schools. Lol.

 

[rrlbees]

I agree there is a problem, but unless the big conferences break away from the NCAA, and set their own rules all the schools will do what they want.

Don’t disagree because the ncaa has no balls. But I also fear that break away will become the wild Wild West and anything goes.

 

[Stern]

I don’t disagree and the reason IMO for the majority public opinion is ignorance. I’ve talked to so many people here and non board people and their knowledge of what NIL is and supposed to be per policy is slim. They can’t see where the line is drawn. Probably because the line is drawn with disappearing ink. At least for some schools. Lol.

I totally agree almost nobody understands what NIL is. They think it means colleges can pay players. Very few understand what NIL Is.

And we also live in a very angry society. I bop around the radio dial and catch the occasional talking head shows on TV and there is this anger that comes through about how, "COACHES CAN MAKE MILLIONS AND LEAVE AT ANY TIME. SO WHY CAN'T PLAYERS."

It drives me nuts because its not an apples to apples comparison. Everyone has a boss at their given job. Bosses are treated different than employees. And Owners are treated different than bosses. In this scenario Coaches are the bosses and players are the employees. There is just a different set of rules, life is unfair.

Nobody is forcing a high school kid to go to college and play sports. But if you do, THIS IS THE RULE. And if you don't like the rule, then don't go! But the rule was, you get free tuition and you play. Now, should there be some form of NIL "within reason"...of course. If a kid wants to get a job to earn a few bucks, ok. If a kids parent dies and the coach wants to fly him home for the funeral, of course. If the school sells a kids jersey with his name and number he should get a cut of the profits, of course!

But open free agency in college sports like we have now will kill college sports. It has killed it, most just don't know it yet. It will be a slow death and it won't happen overnight. But we are 15-20 years away from most of these colleges realizing college sports will become a financial loser (yes even with the crazy TV money) OR they just don't want to be in this athletics business anymore "on that level" where they literally need to hire a financial team and General Manager to manage the budget players are getting paid to play at their school, compared to what similar players are getting elsewhere, and how can we get them more money so they don't leave us and go to another school.

At some point College Presidents will put their arms in the air and say, I give up. It's not worth it. We will have a sports teams, maybe we drop down a level, maybe its not what it once was and the "good ole days" are gone forever, but the financial burden this is going to put on schools will eventually break schools financially and mentally.

When a high school recruit walks in as a Freshman making more $$ than a 2nd, 3rd, or 4th round draft in this past NFL draft, that system is not sustainable. And this isn't just crazy boosters being involved, its crazy schools working side by side with the crazy boosters to make this happen. It's man-hours by the schools being put in. Schools are going to have to hire a team of high priced people to just manage this aspect of college athletics. No college wants to do that whether they can financially afford it or not. Even if they can they just won't want to!

Of course Ohio St, Texas, Oklahoma, Miami, USC and other schools who put a HUGE emphasis on sports will forge ahead and LOVE the new world they are in. Your mid level to smaller schools eventually will crumble and some will go away! It won't be today, won't be tomorrow. Maybe not even in 7 years, but it will happen in our lifetime. And this isn't a prediction, this is a SPOILER!

 

[OrangeXtreme]

 

[sufandu]

I don’t disagree and the reason IMO for the majority public opinion is ignorance. I’ve talked to so many people here and non board people and their knowledge of what NIL is and supposed to be per policy is slim. They can’t see where the line is drawn. Probably because the line is drawn with disappearing ink. At least for some schools. Lol.

It's public ignorance for some and a feeling of helplessness for others. There are knowledgeable fans that knew it would be abused, that the intent wouldn't be followed and the loopholes exploited, and are seeing it play out pretty close to what they anticipated.

 

[Newhouser]

I totally agree almost nobody understands what NIL is. They think it means colleges can pay players. Very few understand what NIL Is.

And we also live in a very angry society. I bop around the radio dial and catch the occasional talking head shows on TV and there is this anger that comes through about how, "COACHES CAN MAKE MILLIONS AND LEAVE AT ANY TIME. SO WHY CAN'T PLAYERS."

It drives me nuts because its not an apples to apples comparison. Everyone has a boss at their given job. Bosses are treated different than employees. And Owners are treated different than bosses. In this scenario Coaches are the bosses and players are the employees. There is just a different set of rules, life is unfair.

Nobody is forcing a high school kid to go to college and play sports. But if you do, THIS IS THE RULE. And if you don't like the rule, then don't go! But the rule was, you get free tuition and you play. Now, should there be some form of NIL "within reason"...of course. If a kid wants to get a job to earn a few bucks, ok. If a kids parent dies and the coach wants to fly him home for the funeral, of course. If the school sells a kids jersey with his name and number he should get a cut of the profits, of course!

But open free agency in college sports like we have now will kill college sports. It has killed it, most just don't know it yet. It will be a slow death and it won't happen overnight. But we are 15-20 years away from most of these colleges realizing college sports will become a financial loser (yes even with the crazy TV money) OR they just don't want to be in this athletics business anymore "on that level" where they literally need to hire a financial team and General Manager to manage the budget players are getting paid to play at their school, compared to what similar players are getting elsewhere, and how can we get them more money so they don't leave us and go to another school.

At some point College Presidents will put their arms in the air and say, I give up. It's not worth it. We will have a sports teams, maybe we drop down a level, maybe its not what it once was and the "good ole days" are gone forever, but the financial burden this is going to put on schools will eventually break schools financially and mentally.

When a high school recruit walks in as a Freshman making more $$ than a 2nd, 3rd, or 4th round draft in this past NFL draft, that system is not sustainable. And this isn't just crazy boosters being involved, its crazy schools working side by side with the crazy boosters to make this happen. It's man-hours by the schools being put in. Schools are going to have to hire a team of high priced people to just manage this aspect of college athletics. No college wants to do that whether they can financially afford it or not. Even if they can they just won't want to!

Of course Ohio St, Texas, Oklahoma, Miami, USC and other schools who put a HUGE emphasis on sports will forge ahead and LOVE the new world they are in. Your mid level to smaller schools eventually will crumble and some will go away! It won't be today, won't be tomorrow. Maybe not even in 7 years, but it will happen in our lifetime. And this isn't a prediction, this is a SPOILER!

Agree with all you said but this evolution pre-dates NIL, and college athletics has constantly evolved and schools are left in the wake every step of the way, and TV or media cash always drives the bus.

The NCAA started to get their foothold post WW II due to a couple of things during the 50s's including but not limited to
1) point shaving scandals and academic scandals ( specifically the cheating scandal at West Point), that opened the door for a governing body.
2) the Wild West appearance of compensating players was rubbing people the wrong way.
3) Most importantly the growing presence of TV hit college sports hard - attendance was down and with gate receipts dragging (and the other factors mentioned above) schools like Fordham and the Ivy's opt to de-emphasize.

The NCAA smartly fills the gap and takes control of TV limiting appearances by schools merging a perfect marriage increasing attendance while also riding the wave of the growth of TV.

NCAA addresses societal ills around the games (fixing, academic cheating, inticement$) by introducing and finally settling on what we know as grant-in aid.

All is well until the 70's when the have's say "I don't want to share" with the have nots and the Divisions are born. From there we all know the story - CFA, to the schools suing and taking back control of TV contracts, to what we have today.

Evolutions leave programs in the dust every step of the way. NIL is just the next phase of this college athletics world, and it will result in more separation and a massive change in the landscape. SU has survived them all, but I am not confident we are ready for the next frontier.

Also think its funny thru all of this - the NCAA didn't start an academic requirement until the late 60's I believe.

At any rate - a lot of typing to say - NIL isn't anything new to the world of college sports. It's media and money, which are constants for nearly a century. The only change (and it is a massive one) is the players are finally getting some legalized $. IF that is the straw that breaks the back of college athletics, they have nobody to blame but themselves. That said the world of college sports has been good at pivoting and I don't think this will be any different when the dust settles. If SU is involved when the coast clears - different conversation.

 

[SWC75]

I totally agree almost nobody understands what NIL is. They think it means colleges can pay players. Very few understand what NIL Is.

And we also live in a very angry society. I bop around the radio dial and catch the occasional talking head shows on TV and there is this anger that comes through about how, "COACHES CAN MAKE MILLIONS AND LEAVE AT ANY TIME. SO WHY CAN'T PLAYERS."

It drives me nuts because its not an apples to apples comparison. Everyone has a boss at their given job. Bosses are treated different than employees. And Owners are treated different than bosses. In this scenario Coaches are the bosses and players are the employees. There is just a different set of rules, life is unfair.

Nobody is forcing a high school kid to go to college and play sports. But if you do, THIS IS THE RULE. And if you don't like the rule, then don't go! But the rule was, you get free tuition and you play. Now, should there be some form of NIL "within reason"...of course. If a kid wants to get a job to earn a few bucks, ok. If a kids parent dies and the coach wants to fly him home for the funeral, of course. If the school sells a kids jersey with his name and number he should get a cut of the profits, of course!

But open free agency in college sports like we have now will kill college sports. It has killed it, most just don't know it yet. It will be a slow death and it won't happen overnight. But we are 15-20 years away from most of these colleges realizing college sports will become a financial loser (yes even with the crazy TV money) OR they just don't want to be in this athletics business anymore "on that level" where they literally need to hire a financial team and General Manager to manage the budget players are getting paid to play at their school, compared to what similar players are getting elsewhere, and how can we get them more money so they don't leave us and go to another school.

At some point College Presidents will put their arms in the air and say, I give up. It's not worth it. We will have a sports teams, maybe we drop down a level, maybe its not what it once was and the "good ole days" are gone forever, but the financial burden this is going to put on schools will eventually break schools financially and mentally.

When a high school recruit walks in as a Freshman making more $$ than a 2nd, 3rd, or 4th round draft in this past NFL draft, that system is not sustainable. And this isn't just crazy boosters being involved, its crazy schools working side by side with the crazy boosters to make this happen. It's man-hours by the schools being put in. Schools are going to have to hire a team of high priced people to just manage this aspect of college athletics. No college wants to do that whether they can financially afford it or not. Even if they can they just won't want to!

Of course Ohio St, Texas, Oklahoma, Miami, USC and other schools who put a HUGE emphasis on sports will forge ahead and LOVE the new world they are in. Your mid level to smaller schools eventually will crumble and some will go away! It won't be today, won't be tomorrow. Maybe not even in 7 years, but it will happen in our lifetime. And this isn't a prediction, this is a SPOILER!

"Nobody is forcing a high school kid to go to college and play sports." Aren't the NFL and the NBA essentially doing this by treating the colleges as their minor leagues? Aren't there a lot of kids playing D-1 football and basketball to get to the NFL and the NBA with their academic interest being to stay eligible so they can play? What does "free tuition" mean to them if they aren't really here for an education?

 

[Stern]

"Nobody is forcing a high school kid to go to college and play sports." Aren't the NFL and the NBA essentially doing this by treating the colleges as their minor leagues? Aren't there a lot of kids playing D-1 football and basketball to get to the NFL and the NBA with their academic interest being to stay eligible so they can play? What does "free tuition" mean to them if they aren't really here for an education?

Let me re-phrase, nobody is forcing anyone to be a professional athlete. Yes, if you want to be in the NFL or NBA you need to go to college and play (minus the rare exceptions). If your end goal is the NFL and NBA but you don't want to go through the necessary steps or process (including college athletics and everything that comes with it) then don't be a Pro Athlete.

It's like me saying I want to be a doctor but I don't want to go to Med School and take out student loans. Guess what, you can't be a Doctor then most likely.

Being a professional athlete is a CHOICE. If someone who has that as their goal doesn't want to go through the process (which includes going to college, going to class, having grades and yeah not making a ton of money while in college) to reach their goal, pick a new goal.

Nobody is lying to these kids when they put pen to paper on a scholarship. They know what the deal is when they agree.

 

[donniesyracuse]

It's like me saying I want to be a doctor but I don't want to go to Med School and take out student loans. Guess what, you can't be a Doctor then most likely.

It is not like that at all. You're not helping that med school sell tickets and generate television revenue.

 

[Horn88]

At some point College Presidents will put their arms in the air and say, I give up. It's not worth it. We will have a sports teams, maybe we drop down a level, maybe its not what it once was and the "good ole days" are gone forever, but the financial burden this is going to put on schools will eventually break schools financially and mentally.

Regarding this specific point, maybe that happens maybe it doesn’t but in that same 15-20 year timeline you mention I think there’s going to be significant headwinds for colleges to sustain/grow enrollment. Giving up that P5 or smaller division one money and marketing would completely change their profile as an institution for some of these schools.

Take away the P5 or D1 athletics and it’s not a long road for some to being lumped in with the private or liberal arts colleges that are likely going to be fighting to keep their doors open or have to find a “sister” school to merge with. I can’t see many of them willingly taking that risk.

 

[Stern]

It is not like that at all. You're not helping that med school sell tickets and generate television revenue.

That is twisting the overall point of this. Everyone can have goals in life of what they want to do. How they get there and what that goal is will be different.

The path to get that goal will be different with each one having unique twists and turns and situations that may not be favorable for you as you fight to reach your goal.

You want to apply the same rules for everything and have a helicopter mom be around and point out what is fair and not fair for everyone and try to make things equal to everyone. That isn't life.

Yes in college football or basketball you need to put in a few years where you will generate money for the schools and TV networks while you see little to nothing in return. Stinks, but do you want to reach your goal? If so then put in the work and time and deal with it.

Or don't. If that truly bothers you (ie the athlete) then don't do it. Again, this is all free choice nobody is being forced to do any of this.

 

[donniesyracuse]

That is twisting the overall point of this. Everyone can have goals in life of what they want to do. How they get there and what that goal is will be different.

The path to get that goal will be different with each one having unique twists and turns and situations that may not be favorable for you as you fight to reach your goal.

You want to apply the same rules for everything and have a helicopter mom be around and point out what is fair and not fair for everyone and try to make things equal to everyone. That isn't life.

Yes in college football or basketball you need to put in a few years where you will generate money for the schools and TV networks while you see little to nothing in return. Stinks, but do you want to reach your goal? If so then put in the work and time and deal with it.

Or don't. If that truly bothers you (ie the athlete) then don't do it. Again, this is all free choice nobody is being forced to do any of this.

Agreed, if people can be exploited, then they should be exploited.

 

[rrlbees]

It's public ignorance for some and a feeling of helplessness for others. There are knowledgeable fans that knew it would be abused, that the intent wouldn't be followed and the loopholes exploited, and are seeing it play out pretty close to what they anticipated.

I’m one of those fans who saw this BS coming. I’ve been screaming since last summer. I just wish more people would educate themselves so that more of the public could see what’s really going on. And im not one to throw my arms in the air and feel helpless. That’s why I’m happy to be part of our collective. It’s not millions that can sway a players decision whether to stay at SU or go somewhere else, but every little bit helps.

 

[sufandu]

I’m one of those fans who saw this BS coming. I’ve been screaming since last summer. I just wish more people would educate themselves so that more of the public could see what’s really going on. And im not one to throw my arms in the air and feel helpless. That’s why I’m happy to be part of our collective. It’s not millions that can sway a players decision whether to stay at SU or go somewhere else, but every little bit helps.

I've been warning against what I thought would happen for 2-3 years. It's transpired differently than I thought, it's a lot more blatant, but not in a way that's surprising. I thought we'd see some Texas/Alabama/Oklahoma/etc. booster buy up 10,000 jersey's of the school's starting QB to demonstrate how much a recruit could make at their school or at least put them in a commercial. Nope, it hasn't even been that sneaky.