Rumor mill

[Macky44]

that apartment building is going up near Van Rensselaer, I think Macky might be talking about the land between Solar and N. Clinton where Harborview Liquors is. They're redoing that street and have leveled all of the land in between.

exactly...

 

[FrancoPizza]

I work about a block away from Inner Harbor and they have been plowing and leveling almost all the huge lots around the Harbor. I keep dreaming they will move the new 44k seat stadium there. Start running the train again from campus to the mall, tailgating all in one location around the new stadium, walking distance from Armory Square etc.. The city is going through a massive upgrade in many areas right now and that would be the icing on the cake...or the salt on the potato if you prefer.

Destiny spent most of the summer moving piles of dirt and spreading it out on some of those lots. Not sure it really means anything though or else we would have probably heard something by now.

 

[IthacaMatt]

Ok, then what? Where do you move them to?

If you were to "flip" the layout for hoops, you would have to do it for the moveable bleachers. They're movable, right? You don't see them out there for football games. The locker rooms were targeted for renovation anyway. You need to bring in cranes to move the scoreboards and screens that are targeted to the hoops attendee to the other end. That, to me, would seem to be the biggest logistical issue rather than putting in new tracks for the temporary bleachers.

 

[IthacaMatt]

I work about a block away from Inner Harbor and they have been plowing and leveling almost all the huge lots around the Harbor. I keep dreaming they will move the new 44k seat stadium there. Start running the train again from campus to the mall, tailgating all in one location around the new stadium, walking distance from Armory Square etc.. The city is going through a massive upgrade in many areas right now and that would be the icing on the cake...or the salt on the potato if you prefer.

That's too obviously the best idea. That's why it'll never happen.

 

[KellySyracuse]

That's too obviously the best idea. That's why it'll never happen.

I'm pretty sure Congel owns the land at that spot on N. Clinton. It's his crew that moving the dirt piles from the Destiny overflow parking lots. I've got to say they've done a ton of work over the summer and they are putting in drainage and what looks to me to be sewers along the street. It's been closed for about the past month and not even close to being done. It certainly will be interesting to see . what gets announced for that plot of land. I can't imagine that it sits empty.

 

[rrlbees]

If you were to "flip" the layout for hoops, you would have to do it for the moveable bleachers. They're movable, right? You don't see them out there for football games. The locker rooms were targeted for renovation anyway. You need to bring in cranes to move the scoreboards and screens that are targeted to the hoops attendee to the other end. That, to me, would seem to be the biggest logistical issue rather than putting in new tracks for the temporary bleachers.

Still not getting your point. Where would you put the movable bleachers with the court at the other end? Leave them where they are or move them to the other side of the court since they're movable? Either way, one side of the court will have so 1st level seating.

 

[IthacaMatt]

I'm pretty sure Congel owns the land at that spot on N. Clinton. It's his crew that moving the dirt piles from the Destiny overflow parking lots. I've got to say they've done a ton of work over the summer and they are putting in drainage and what looks to me to be sewers along the street. It's been closed for about the past month and not even close to being done. It certainly will be interesting to see . what gets announced for that plot of land. I can't imagine that it sits empty.

Congel owns some of it, but it may only be an option with a deadline for development or else it can be taken back through eminent domain. I haven't kept close tabs on this in a couple years, but used to work as a real estate attorney for Pyramid. That would explain why they are out there pushing dirt from time to time, so they can claim that they have done site development work to keep the option alive. I don't think he will build on there unless 81 remains in place. Matt Driscoll just being appointed head of the DOT by Cuomo makes it pretty likely that Congel gets his way, and Route 81 becomes the big tunnel dig through there, despite anyone who doesn't have a vested interest saying that's the most expensive and least desirable option. It's going to flood all the time. At one point, the Barge Canal system took the land back, but then it may have changed hands to the local government again.

 

[OrangeXtreme]

If you were to "flip" the layout for hoops, you would have to do it for the moveable bleachers. They're movable, right? You don't see them out there for football games. The locker rooms were targeted for renovation anyway. You need to bring in cranes to move the scoreboards and screens that are targeted to the hoops attendee to the other end. That, to me, would seem to be the biggest logistical issue rather than putting in new tracks for the temporary bleachers.

The only moveable bleachers are Sec 122-125:

Since Sec 107-110 don't move, if you flip the layout, you have this:

Probably not what you want.

 

[IthacaMatt]

Still not getting your point. Where would you put the movable bleachers with the court at the other end? Leave them where they are or move them to the other side of the court since they're movable? Either way, one side of the court will have so 1st level seating.

I'm not getting your point, I guess.

If the bleachers cross the football field at a certain point, what is to stop them from simply making a mirror image floor plan and putting the moveable bleachers facing in the other direction toward the other end of the stands? Am I missing something here? They are mobile bleachers. Run the tracks for them on the other side, facing the other end of the Dome - exactly like they are right now, but if you flipped the floor plan.

 

[oldpinepoint]

Congel owns some of it, but it may only be an option with a deadline for development or else it can be taken back through eminent domain. I haven't kept close tabs on this in a couple years, but used to work as a real estate attorney for Pyramid. That would explain why they are out there pushing dirt from time to time, so they can claim that they have done site development work to keep the option alive. I don't think he will build on there unless 81 remains in place. Matt Driscoll just being appointed head of the DOT by Cuomo makes it pretty likely that Congel gets his way, and Route 81 becomes the big tunnel dig through there, despite anyone who doesn't have a vested interest saying that's the most expensive and least desirable option. It's going to flood all the time. At one point, the Barge Canal system took the land back, but then it may have changed hands to the local government again.

I think it has to do with tax credits and brownfield remediation. However you can see the potential of putting a stadium down there with all that open space

 

[rrlbees]

I'm not getting your point, I guess. If the bleachers cross the football field at a certain point, what is to stop them from simply making a mirror image floor plan and putting the moveable bleachers facing in the other direction toward the other end of the stands? Am I missing something here? They are mobile bleachers. Run the tracks for them on the other side, facing the other end of the Dome - exactly like they are right now, but if you flipped the floor plan.

Then what goes where the movable bleachers are now? There's only one set of movable. Look at Oxs pic.

 

[CuseTroop]

Then what goes where the movable bleachers are now? There's only one set of movable. Look at Oxs pic.

Where do they go now?

 

[dollarbill44]

Disagree. Not with the costly part, that is definitely true, but it is FAR from easy, and it has a UGE ripple effect. Drainage = crowned field. Crowned field = challenges to seating/bleachers/court for basketball. Crowned field = different depth perception for football (taking some home field advantage). Crowned filed = practice facility that does not mimic gameday facility. Look earlier in the thread, I think this has been covered.

You don't have to crown the field any more for drainage. You raise the field and put the drainage underneath it. They do this at most of the new stadiums. The field is basically on a platform. The field itself is permeable so the water drains straight through it. I think I read that some field can handle 9"of rain without problems using this method. I have no idea what it costs, but this would be the way to do it.

 

[FrancoPizza]

Congel owns some of it, but it may only be an option with a deadline for development or else it can be taken back through eminent domain. I haven't kept close tabs on this in a couple years, but used to work as a real estate attorney for Pyramid. That would explain why they are out there pushing dirt from time to time, so they can claim that they have done site development work to keep the option alive. I don't think he will build on there unless 81 remains in place. Matt Driscoll just being appointed head of the DOT by Cuomo makes it pretty likely that Congel gets his way, and Route 81 becomes the big tunnel dig through there, despite anyone who doesn't have a vested interest saying that's the most expensive and least desirable option. It's going to flood all the time. At one point, the Barge Canal system took the land back, but then it may have changed hands to the local government again.

Or they could be planning to put up some condos/luxury apartments - which seems to be the safest investment in the city these days. Or maybe they just want to improve the sight lines with the inner harbor.

Not sure how to read the Driscoll appointment. "Pretty likely" to go with the tunnel may be an overreaction unless you have some inside information. My impression is the DOT will do everything they can to justify the cheapest option.

Regardless of what happens with 81 I think destiny needs to worry about leasing the expansion first before they entertain other ideas. Maybe they have to scale back the outlet strategy or something because it's been 3-4 years and they still have about 200k sq feet of empty space in the addition.

But put a new stadium down the street and you'd see a who's who of A list tenants fighting for a spot in the mall. The harbor area/lakefront would reach critical mass that would sustain continued development.

 

[AZOrange]

Destiny spent most of the summer moving piles of dirt and spreading it out on some of those lots. Not sure it really means anything though or else we would have probably heard something by now.

Contamination?

 

[rrlbees]

Where do they go now?

They are the end zone seats for football and the for basketball they wheel then across the field to the other end as the bleachers on that side of the court.

 

[KellySyracuse]

Congel owns some of it, but it may only be an option with a deadline for development or else it can be taken back through eminent domain. I haven't kept close tabs on this in a couple years, but used to work as a real estate attorney for Pyramid. That would explain why they are out there pushing dirt from time to time, so they can claim that they have done site development work to keep the option alive. I don't think he will build on there unless 81 remains in place. Matt Driscoll just being appointed head of the DOT by Cuomo makes it pretty likely that Congel gets his way, and Route 81 becomes the big tunnel dig through there, despite anyone who doesn't have a vested interest saying that's the most expensive and least desirable option. It's going to flood all the time. At one point, the Barge Canal system took the land back, but then it may have changed hands to the local government again.

oh god, when I read that Driscoll was going to be the Rt 81 decider a shot of despair went through me. A tunnel is the worst plan yet, all because Congel's mall when half those stores won't be there in 25 years when a tunnel finally gets completed.

 

[orangenauburn]

oh god, when I read that Driscoll was going to be the Rt 81 decider a shot of despair went through me. A tunnel is the worst plan yet, all because Congel's mall when half those stores won't be there in 25 years when a tunnel finally gets completed.

Which is why a stadium there will keep crowds in the area as long as there is something there to do ... They go hand in hand

I don't care ... Make a deal with the devil: Congel and Halbritter fund it

 

[KellySyracuse]

Contamination?

the dirt at one time had been contaminated, they had to wait x number of years for bacteria to eat the contamination or something along those lines before they could move it. Pretty sure I read that on Syracuse.com, I'll see if I can find the link.

 

[Cusefan0307]

Why would we build a stadium in the inner harbor? It would be repeating the same mistake twice. They built the baseball park on the north side and virtually everyone admits that should of went downtown. There's no way building a stadium on the inner harbor would allow guarantee you more parking for tailgating. Chances are if anything the parking to be developed would be parking garages just like we have at the university now, and because you basically have zero control of a structure you don't own, you lose some of the advantages you get with a home field/court such as the ability to practice there whenever you want. Also we are trying to grow the fan base. Not turn off current and future students for years to come because a bunch of 30-50 year old
men don't want to come to campus.

 

[FrancoPizza]

oh god, when I read that Driscoll was going to be the Rt 81 decider a shot of despair went through me. A tunnel is the worst plan yet, all because Congel's mall when half those stores won't be there in 25 years when a tunnel finally gets completed.

I'll be shocked if the tunnel goes through. But regardless I think it would be a BS move to relocate an interstate when businesses have located and invested strategically because of its proximity.

State and liberals can spin it all they want - but the bottom line is the state will look for any angle to justify Erie boulevard 2.0.

 

[Toga]

From a State timing perspective - an excerpt from an article today about the Capital District's 235 page proposal for $500M.
"Gov. Andrew Cuomo's Upstate Revitalization Initiative, a super-sized version of the annual regional economic development grants that will award three grant packages of $500 million apiece. Winners are expected to be announced by the end of the year."

 

[KellySyracuse]

From a State timing perspective - an excerpt from an article today about the Capital District's 235 page proposal for $500M.
"Gov. Andrew Cuomo's Upstate Revitalization Initiative, a super-sized version of the annual regional economic development grants that will award three grant packages of $500 million apiece. Winners are expected to be announced by the end of the year."

I would not be shocked in the least if Cuomo comes up with state cash for a stadium, knowing that it is the Dome is the only stadium in NYS that is big enough to support Syracuse basketball. Actually I have no doubt that something is already in the works and we'll hear about it around Christmas. Just an uneducated guess

 

[GoSU96]

Why would we build a stadium in the inner harbor? It would be repeating the same mistake twice. They built the baseball park on the north side and virtually everyone admits that should of went downtown. There's no way building a stadium on the inner harbor would allow guarantee you more parking for tailgating. Chances are if anything the parking to be developed would be parking garages just like we have at the university now, and because you basically have zero control of a structure you don't own, you lose some of the advantages you get with a home field/court such as the ability to practice there whenever you want. Also we are trying to grow the fan base. Not turn off current and future students for years to come because a bunch of 30-50 year old
men don't want to come to campus.

Well that's just crazy. There are at least six and up to eight large parking lots across Bear Street. That set up would absolutely guarantee you better tailgating.

Practice is taken care of with the IPF and Melo.

As for control its something you work out with the operator as the major tenant. You might lose total control but you also shed expenses while keeping revenues.

 

[retro44]

that apartment building is going up near Van Rensselaer, I think Macky might be talking about the land between Solar and N. Clinton where Harborview Liquors is. They're redoing that street and have leveled all of the land in between.

That lot has also been talked about with the building trades. This issue has not been settled like some are saying.

I know for a fact the Building trades are pushing hard for a new stadium at the Fairgrounds,doesn't mean it will happen,but there is a big push for a new stadium period and the Inner Harbor was also being thrown around.