The Coyle decision

[Crusty]

Interesting. Hadn't seen that before. But was that just a B1G analysis, or...?

It was 2000 to 2014 Big 10 Only. Fox Sports
"It's not by accident the schools that usually recruit well, play well," Ohio State coach Urban Meyer said. "There's some guys out there that know what they're doing in recruiting services. So I will take a peek at that. But that's not how you make decisions. A five-star recruit usually has a better career than other ones.
"There's always great examples of a young late-developer. But those recruiting analysts aren't bad now. They do a good job."
Foxsports.

I have seen other similar D1 studies. Collectively, they have been dispositive in my mind. Much as we like to think our recruiting has improved it is hard to argue with the numbers anymore. They are what they are.

 

[BKCuse]

I'm much more interested in the offseason coaching search than the final two games.

Is that bad?

At least there is something worth following regarding Cuse football.

 

[Alsacs]

Shafer gets credit for that. Unless you're loping off all the defensive recruits that Shafer brought in for Marrone.

I have no problem giving Dungey credit to SS. I just don't see the kids Dasher was saying SS is getting from P5 schools.
Our 2o14 class is not littered with kids with multiple P5 offers.
The same with our 2015 class.
Our classes have gotten slightly better because the bottom of those classes are better. We aren't bringing in 4 star kids at the top of classes ro make them better. Our bottom are slightly better thus they make the overall 51st instead of 55th.


This narrative SS is great recruiter is bogus. He is just slightly better than Marrone. Keeping him because our of recruiting would be stupid.

 

[TheCusian]

I have no problem giving Dungey credit to SS. I just don't see the kids Dasher was saying SS is getting from P5 schools. Our 2o14 class is not littered with kids with multiple P5 offers. The same with our 2015 class. Our classes have gotten slightly better because the bottom of those classes are better. We aren't bringing in 4 star kids at the top of classes ro make them better. Our bottom are slightly better thus they make the overall 51st instead of 55th. This narrative SS is great recruiter is bogus. He is just slightly better than Marrone. Keeping him because our of recruiting would be stupid.

I agree with all that. The quality of kid is better - but the competition is tougher. Marrone could get by because he was a better coach playing against talent that wasn't quite the gap we see now. Clemson and FSU > Louisville and WVU

 

[Alsacs]

I agree with all that. The quality of kid is better - but the competition is tougher. Marrone could get by because he was a better coach playing against talent that wasn't quite the gap we see now. Clemson and FSU > Louisville and WVU

Or maybe Marrone could coach better. I mean c'mon you make Devil's Advocate posts every time. The quality has probably gone from 2.5 to 2.75 out of 5. Our coaching has gone from 2.75 to 1.75 out of 5.

Marrone would have schemed a lot better.

 

[Scooch]

I agree that no one is a better fan because they support the coach, or because they want change. We're all obviously enormous fans. But there are definitely sides, as we've seen on this board. The board has been completely overrun by the two sides just going back and forth at each other, and it's gotten freaking unbearable. It's taking the fun out of actually being a "fan." How many times can people just yell back and forth at each other, and in how many threads? And I'm not saying any one side is more right than the other, either. Both sides, I think, have some valid reasons to think the way they do. But my god...the smugness and lack of civility from some posters on both sides is just making this board godawful lately.

In all sincerity, if a message board takes the fun out of following a team then don't read the board. End story.

 

[OttoinGrotto]

In all sincerity, if a message board takes the fun out of following a team then don't read the board. End story.

For me, with all of the consistently crappy football over the years the board is where the fun in following the team is.

 

[Alsacs]

In all sincerity, if a message board takes the fun out of following a team then don't read the board. End story.

LSU fans on their board are talking about getting rid of a coach who has gone 110-31 with 3 SEC titles and 1 NC and people think it is annoying hearing the arguments from both sides about SS as SU coach.

I don't read things on this board that don't interest me.

Nothing short of our program going thru an NCAA investigation can take the fun out of following the team I love. Debating something obviously relevant numerous times is not going to cause me to care less about my team when both sides have a valid point.

 

[dasher]

Or maybe Marrone could coach better. I mean c'mon you make Devil's Advocate posts every time. The quality has probably gone from 2.5 to 2.75 out of 5. Our coaching has gone from 2.75 to 1.75 out of 5.

Marrone would have schemed a lot better.

2.75 vs 2.50 is a good sized difference when you string it out over 20 players. I think what I see is that year after year, the current staff is recruiting kids that have more decent P 5 offers than the kids we were getting under Marrone. Player X may have had 2 P 5 offers under Marrone but they were lesser P 5 teams than the player B is getting under SS. I don't really think there is any doubt about that. Marrone didn't get any skill players with the offers that Culpepper has. Or Moe Neal for that matter. Is the difference enough to save SS's job? Different issue. Look, it's obvious that SS has very little skill at game management or clock management. The evidence is out there every week. He seems to make glaring mistakes every week. A smaller issue is that it seems that he is very thin skinned about it. I will say this, I would not fire him without KNOWING who I was going to be able to hire. I wouldn't blow up this recruiting class without knowing I had a man in place that was a upgrade. Sorry, I just don't trust that we will get a better choice just because well, he can't be any worse.

 

[OburgOrange]

I read somewhere that we are still paying Gerg. Is this true? If so, the writing is on the wall. No way the school fires Shafer after this year and have to pay Gerg, Shafer and a new HC next year. No way.

 

[dasher]

I read somewhere that we are still paying Gerg. Is this true? If so, the writing is on the wall. No way the school fires Shafer after this year and have to pay Gerg, Shafer and a new HC next year. No way.

I can't believe that would be true. It's been at least 7 years. And $$ might be an issue with firing SS but if you are the A.D. and believe he isn't the right guy, how much does it cost you to keep the wrong guy?

 

[Alsacs]

2.75 vs 2.50 is a good sized difference when you string it out over 20 players. I think what I see is that year after year, the current staff is recruiting kids that have more decent P 5 offers than the kids we were getting under Marrone. Player X may have had 2 P 5 offers under Marrone but they were lesser P 5 teams than the player B is getting under SS. I don't really think there is any doubt about that. Marrone didn't get any skill players with the offers that Culpepper has. Or Moe Neal for that matter. Is the difference enough to save SS's job? Different issue. Look, it's obvious that SS has very little skill at game management or clock management. The evidence is out there every week. He seems to make glaring mistakes every week. A smaller issue is that it seems that he is very thin skinned about it. I will say this, I would not fire him without KNOWING who I was going to be able to hire. I wouldn't blow up this recruiting class without knowing I had a man in place that was a upgrade. Sorry, I just don't trust that we will get a better choice just because well, he can't be any worse.

I know Moe Neal. My good friend is a football coach(if you PM and want more info I can give you more details) at South Point in Gastonia, NC. They are arch-rivals with Forestview which is Neal's school. He told me Neal was a good legit D-1 player but the coaches at UNC didn't recruit him and UNC recruits Charlotte heavily.

I don't think Neal is the guy I would pin my hopes playing much next year. He will be behind Philips/Strickland. He is a player very similar to Dion Lewis from Pitt. I watched the Forest View-South Point game from the sidelines and he scored their only TD(Southpoint beat them like 27-7 or something) but was shut down running the ball. He did his damage on swing passes but he didn't scream superstar.

Culpepper was a good job by SS. I don't know anything of his game.

I don't think this recruiting class should be the reason to keep SS. Culpepper already signed his Financial aid formhe is coming to SU in January. I also don't think this staff should be rewarded with more money it would talk to keep them. We aren't blowing up a top 40 recruiting class. This class is smaller this year because we don't have as many scholarships to give out. I think we can upgrade easily and should. The recruiting isn't that great it just slightly better than DM.

 

[Alsacs]

I read somewhere that we are still paying Gerg. Is this true? If so, the writing is on the wall. No way the school fires Shafer after this year and have to pay Gerg, Shafer and a new HC next year. No way.

Gerg had a 5 year contract. We had to pay for the 2009 season. Unless he agreed to take like 250k for 4 years rather than 1 million all in 1 year or something like that it can't be true.
Also SS only has 1 year left on his 1.4 million per year contract.

 

[rrlbees]

I read somewhere that we are still paying Gerg. Is this true? If so, the writing is on the wall. No way the school fires Shafer after this year and have to pay Gerg, Shafer and a new HC next year. No way.

One poster said that. Grobs buyout was about $1.1 million. I doubt it was spread over this many years. Sometimes those things might be paid over 2-3 years but never heard 7.

 

[dasher]

I know Moe Neal. My good friend is a football coach(if you PM and want more info I can give you more details) at South Point in Gastonia, NC. They are arch-rivals with Forestview which is Neal's school. He told me Neal was a good legit D-1 player but the coaches at UNC didn't recruit him and UNC recruits Charlotte heavily.

I don't think Neal is the guy I would pin my hopes playing much next year. He will be behind Philips/Strickland. He is a player very similar to Dion Lewis from Pitt. I watched the Forest View-South Point game from the sidelines and he scored their only TD(Southpoint beat them like 27-7 or something) but was shut down running the ball. He did his damage on swing passes but he didn't scream superstar.

Culpepper was a good job by SS. I don't know anything of his game.

I don't think this recruiting class should be the reason to keep SS. Culpepper already signed his Financial aid formhe is coming to SU in January. I also don't think this staff should be rewarded with more money it would talk to keep them. We aren't blowing up a top 40 recruiting class. This class is smaller this year because we don't have as many scholarships to give out. I think we can upgrade easily and should. The recruiting isn't that great it just slightly better than DM.

Moe Neal has offers from Boston College, Duke, G-Tech, Miss St., N.C. State, Wake Forrest and West Virginia. That he hasn't got an offer from UNC is meaningless to me. He has 8 P 5 offers. Good enough for me. And I don't care if he plays a down next year. It's better than recruiting guys that have offers from Towson St, New Hampshire and Monmouth (does Monmouth even have a team?)

 

[Ringostar57]

Coyle's decision has been made. Will be announced in a week.

 

[FAL]

Coyle's decision has been made. Will be announced in a week.

So you mean right after the BC game?

 

[TheCusian]

Or maybe Marrone could coach better. I mean c'mon you make Devil's Advocate posts every time. The quality has probably gone from 2.5 to 2.75 out of 5. Our coaching has gone from 2.75 to 1.75 out of 5. Marrone would have schemed a lot better.

And the comp went from like a 2.5 to a 3.

I was agreeing with you.

 

[BKCuse]

Coyle's decision has been made. Will be announced in a week.

Is this speculation or inside knowledge?

 

[elimunelson]

It's common sense

 

[AZOrange]

we are very far from rock bottom as a program. I mean we aren't even close.

Maybe, but we've hit a iceberg at least.

 

[AZOrange]

Yep. A very bizarre inefficiency.

I'm not sure why you think hoarding of resources is bizarre.

 

[OttoinGrotto]

I'm not sure why you think hoarding of resources is bizarre.

Because it's an educational institution.

 

[Crusty]

Shafer is gone. Take it to the bank. I doubt he will last the week. The pressure is enormous and he is melting down. Feel badly for him, but this really is over. No point in waiting any more. Get it over for everyone AD Coyle.

 

[tep624]

One poster said that. Grobs buyout was about $1.1 million. I doubt it was spread over this many years. Sometimes those things might be paid over 2-3 years but never heard 7.

I've never heard of that either and I'm a CPA. I've seen 18 or 24 month severance packages but that is usually contractual. Unless for tax purposes he requested some long term deal. The university isn't getting any benefit from it so I would think they would have taken the P&L hit for it up front anyway in 2009. Should just be a cash outflow at this point if they are in fact still paying him.