The Shady to Tennessee thread (it was fun while it lasted)...

[Alsacs]

What if Tom Brady put in a good word?

Again I think for myself.
Teams/players I like don’t tell me what to think.
I think Schiano is pond scum no matter if Brady/Belichick/you name them think he is great.

 

[Trueblue25]

What if Tom Brady put in a good word?

Low blow!

 

[sufandu]

Actually, with a state university, i think the residents of Tennessee are the "customers" if that is even the right term. It's a weird scenario when you are dealing with a state employee at a non profit organization.

I think we're seeing the deconstruction of alot of "the way things were" society. I am shocked that the NCAA is still standing in these mob rule scenarios that are starting to show up more and more.

Since the budget of the AD is separate from the rest of the university, I think it's narrower than all Tennessee residents. It's the people that support the AD financially through licensed apparel, ticket purchases, and donations.

Customer is a fair term. College sports are, at least in part, a commodity the universities sell to the public. Without people willing to pay in one way or another, they become D3 sports.

 

[bpo57]

Again I think for myself.
Teams/players I like don’t tell me what to think.
I think Schiano is pond scum no matter if Brady/Belichick/you name them think he is great.

It's one thing to not like a coach for a variety of reasons but to trash somebody's rep on flimsy evidence cuz u (not you) don't want him as your football coach. That's horse sheet.

 

[elimunelson]

Since the budget of the AD is separate from the rest of the university, I think it's narrower than all Tennessee residents. It's the people that support the AD financially through licensed apparel, ticket purchases, and donations.

Customer is a fair term. College sports are, at least in part, a commodity the universities sell to the public. With people willing to pay in one way or another, they become D3 sports.

i hear you but let me ask u another way, if UT decided to disband the university, fair to say the AD office would be disbanded as well. It needs a school to operate. It's akin to having the dept of engineering. the AD does pay its employees through state funds i would think. ALot of donations for sure but it's not an independently run operation.

 

[leftytg]

It's one thing to not like a coach for a variety of reasons but to trash somebody's rep on flimsy evidence cuz u (not you) don't want him as your football coach. That's horse sheet.

reasonable minds can differ as to the strength and reliability, but the evidence is not nearly as flimsy as you seem desperate to believe.

 

[bpo57]

reasonable minds can differ as to the strength and reliability, but the evidence is not nearly as flimsy as you seem desperate to believe.

Desperate? lol. The desperation seems to be associated much more with the accusers. This scandal was examined thoroughly from every angle with several charged. How come nothing against Schiano? Why did Urban Meyer hire him? You don't think he was vetted by Meyer?

 

[sufandu]

i hear you but let me ask u another way, if UT decided to disband the university, fair to say the AD office would be disbanded as well. It needs a school to operate. It's akin to having the dept of engineering. the AD does pay its employees through state funds i would think. ALot of donations for sure but it's not an independently run operation.

I believe I've been told the AD is completely separate with regards to money. Of course it needs the existence of the university for purposes of identity. I don't think that affects my previous point of listening to customers. Get rid of ticket purchases, donations, etc. and there are no ahtletics. Therefore, don't piss off the people responsible for all of that with a decision they obviously disagree with. It's not like this hire was controversial within the fanbase. It was universally despised.

 

[Chip]

It's one thing to not like a coach for a variety of reasons but to trash somebody's rep on flimsy evidence cuz u (not you) don't want him as your football coach. That's horse sheet.

Tennessee fans aren't the ones who trashed his rep.

McQuery did (under oath). And the NYTimes did, by writing that article.

Tennessee fans just reminded everyone of it because they didn't want him to be their coach. I think if it were Florida, or Texas A&M, or even Arkansas, you would have seen something similar. Maybe not quite as intense (thanks Clay Travis), but enough to get high powered people to disrupt the process and use that previously published news.

Wrong scandal to be connected with. Schiano is toast for a head coaching role. Court of public opinion won't lose this one. People are too caught up in whether or not he committed a crime or is charge with a crime. Irrelevant to this situation.

 

[djcon57]

If Payton Manning agreed to be head coach, do you think Tennesee fans would care about his alledged sexual assault?

I don't. It's very transparent.

Fwiw I don't necessarily think Manning was guilty. Doesn't change my point.

 

[Chip]

If Payton Manning agreed to be head coach, do you think Tennesee fans would care about his alledged s e xual assault?

I don't. It's very transparent.

Fwiw I don't necessarily think Manning was guilty. Doesn't change my point.

Better example is probably Petrino. If he gets announced, is anyone going to bring up his laundry list of issues? Probably not.

But I do love a good internet mess, so I have to admit it’s been fun.

 

[djcon57]

Better example is probably Petrino. If he gets announced, is anyone going to bring up his laundry list of issues? Probably not.

But I do love a good internet mess, so I have to admit it’s been fun.

We can all love an internet mess. If Tennessee fan wanted to pitch a fit because he sucks as a coach and is by all accounts a big douche, fine.

I would think with what we dealt with the public calling (and many fans still call) Boeheim a ped o enabler, we would see the other side here. I have a problem with that hard of a charge based on something he might have not even said.

 

[DeGrozz]

reasonable minds can differ as to the strength and reliability, but the evidence is not nearly as flimsy as you seem desperate to believe.

Isn't the only evidence that Mike McQueary said that Tom Bradley said that Greg Schiano said that he saw Sandusky in the act in the 1980s? That's what I'm trying to figure out -- Sandusky's crimes have probably been looked at by law enforcement, private investigators, and investigative journalists more than any sports story in history -- if the only thing linking Monkeyface to crimes is two sentences about hearsay in one deposition, should it really cause him to essentially be blacklisted for the rest of his career?

Significantly worse things were said about Boeheim during the Fine investigations and Cuse Nation was pretty comfortable shrugging them off...

 

[elimunelson]

Isn't the only evidence that Mike McQueary said that Tom Bradley said that Greg Schiano said that he saw Sandusky in the act in the 1980s? That's what I'm trying to figure out -- Sandusky's crimes have probably been looked at by law enforcement, private investigators, and investigative journalists more than any sports story in history -- if the only thing linking Monkeyface to crimes is two sentences about hearsay in one deposition, should it really cause him to essentially be blacklisted for the rest of his career?

Significantly worse things were said about Boeheim during the Fine investigations and Cuse Nation was pretty comfortable shrugging them off...

Absolutely. Bernie Fine would have taken down Jim Boeheim if we applied same standards as the Sandusky situation. Thankfully Jim wasn't taken down and Bernie was only guilty of being an outed gay man if i recall the tea leaves from those in the know.

Schiano should absolutely be vetted and asked about the Penn St situation. Tom Bradley has since refuted it and who knows why or if he actually had the facts straight when he told McQueary. If I recall Schiano was a young assistant when he was with Penn St.

 

[OrangeXtreme]

 

[OrangeXtreme]

 

[cuseincincy]

Penn State's President, Vice President and AD were all convicted of misdemeanor charges of child endangerment and all did jail time. Why wasn't Schiano charged?

Because he was just another peon assistant coach. Do you really think NONE of the assistants at Penn St over the years ever saw anything. Ever suspected anything? He wasn't charged with anything because you don't charge down the ladder for negligence, only up the ladder. The ones up the ladder shouldered the "legal responsibility." You can choose to believe that because he wasn't charged equates to not knowing anything. I choose to believe that every coach at Pedd St that worked with and under Jerry Sandusky knew he was scum. I'm most likely wrong but that doesn't change my belief.

 

[rrlbees]

But I still have a university to attend.

That wasn’t quite the point.

 

[rrlbees]

I agree with you on Paterno. But you nor anybody else have anything on Schiano.

Except the word of the only person to testify under oath.

 

[OttoinGrotto]

Anthony Lubrano may be making fair points there, but my gosh he comes across horribly.

 

[rrlbees]

That guys been trying to exonerate paterno for years. Notice he doesn’t mention testimony under oath. Just beats up current social media.

 

[CuseOnly]

That's my point - because they've got zero evidence against him.

All of the victims sued the school didn't they, and were paid off.

 

[PoppyHart]

I think the way Schiano was treated here was embarrassing. For UT's sake, unless the next hire has the words "Saint" or "Mother" as a prefix they're in for a wild ride.

 

[cuseincincy]

At the end of the day...couldnt happen to a better guy. :rolling:

 

[leftytg]

Isn't the only evidence that Mike McQueary said that Tom Bradley said that Greg Schiano said that he saw Sandusky in the act in the 1980s? That's what I'm trying to figure out -- Sandusky's crimes have probably been looked at by law enforcement, private investigators, and investigative journalists more than any sports story in history -- if the only thing linking Monkeyface to crimes is two sentences about hearsay in one deposition, should it really cause him to essentially be blacklisted for the rest of his career?

Significantly worse things were said about Boeheim during the Fine investigations and Cuse Nation was pretty comfortable shrugging them off...

this isn't even close to being true and shows a fundamental misunderstanding of this type of crime, how it came about, and how it was allowed to fester. I'll just ask - do you think anyone (outside of Sandusky himself) knows exactly how many victims there were? How extensive the damage was? The nature of long term predatory child sexual abuse is such that this is probably the most poorly understood major crime story in sports history.

I do child abuse and neglect cases for a living. I see awful things that would make you want to blind yourself, and I've sorted through false accusations and/or had findings overturned. This kind of thing isn't new to me. I don't have the time or inclination to explain how things work to the wannabe message board lawyers out there with their supposed gotcha logical points (i.e. if it were true why wasn't Schiano sued or prosecuted).

Is there a legit point to make about hearsay? Absolutely. Is the statement by McQueary iron clad proof? Of course not. It is most definitely hearsay. However, just because something is hearsay doesn't automatically make it untrue. Would it be admissible in court? Nope. But this isn't court. As with anything else, you examine a statement in context and assess its credibility. This message board believes as true TONS of things that are hearsay.

It is perfectly defensible to conclude that hearsay of this sort is such that one isn't comfortable drawing conclusions. I respect that position and a reasonable mind can conclude such.
It is also perfectly defensible to examine McQueary's statement in the deposition that Bradley told him Schiano came forward and conclude that given the circumstances, McQueary was telling the truth. That Bradley did say that, and if Bradley said that at the time it was probably true (why would Bradley make something like that up?) Given that we know Sandusky was a serial predator and had no qualms about bringing children in the football facilities/locker rooms and sexually molesting them, it isn't a stretch that another Penn State coach saw a situation similar to what McQueary saw. Does this position require more of a willingness to read between lines and speculate? Absolutely. It wouldn't and shouldn't be enough to convict under the law. But in forming an opinion? Based on my experience, I absolutely believe that Bradley told McQueary that Schiano had walked in on Sandusky abusing a child.

My issue isn't so much that one believe a version over the other. As I said, I believe reasonable minds can differ there. I object to the condescending attitude by some in this thread as if believing hearsay is some kind of ridiculous thing and there is no way any of it could be true.