This is why you play Shrader…

[alphaorange]

I just watched GS passing plays from MSU again. To say he can't pass is just wrong. Sure, he had several really bad pass attempts, but he also mad many more really good passes, several of them down field. He'll be fine.

 

[OrangeMojo]

Shrader isn't great, but the play calling is horrific. When Gilbert was OC at UT, one the biggest complaints about him were a complete lack of diversity in play calling, zero sophistication or creativity in the passing game and non-strategic play calling... i.e. he doesn't seem to call one play to set up another instead if a play works he just calls it over and over again well past the point of it working, even if the other team is sitting not that play.

This is what we saw in the 2nd half... Liberty was sitting on the base RPO that we were running and Gilbert called it over and over and over and over again. What we should have done in the 2nd half is a crap ton of play action and screen passes. Shrader can't hit the deep, but he seems to have no problem with the intermediate/short passes. The main issue is that those plays don't seem to be a part of this offense. Again last night, where was the TE in the passing game? Where were the slants? The short hitches where the WR just sits where the LB has vacated to go stop the run? Where were the WR screens we saw earlier in the year? At one point, the announcer stated that Babers is a "screen-game guy" and I almost spit out my drink because in my 5 years of watching Babers-ball we have barely used the screen.

I did see a few positives... we ran two or three screens to Tucker and they went for decent yardage. We stopped throwing the dumb deep side line pass to Harris which almost next works.

There is talent on this squad... it's not clear that the we have the offensive coaching staff to really do anything with it.

Agree - I don’t think it matters which QB they start the rest of the way if Gilbert can’t improve as a play caller. When the original game plan was working, it was fine. Once Liberty had time to adjust, the offense got stiffed and Gilbert showed absolutely no ability to adapt or be creative in any way to take advantage of what the defense was doing.

Freeze/Liberty adapted and started moving the ball in the second half. The out and up route against Chestnutt was a perfect example. Gilbert/Babers can’t or won’t do this and it’s infuriating.

 

[CousCuse]

"And that's why you pay 'Ackett".

 

[capeorange]

Incorrect. Under pressure he graded FAR better than Shrader. He got rocked just as he released that bomb to Alford last week.

Vs Albany Tommy posted an ELITE 90.4 grade. Garrett a failing 58.6. Thats why so few passes for Garrett. He's a runner. Passing without pressure is the problem.

Vs Albany...lol

Tommy is like the best skier on the bunny hill but put him on anything steep or with bumps and he falls apart.

 

[capeorange]

Devito has more wins then shredder

GS has won 100% of his starts at SU.

So what?

 

[FloridaFan]

Ok. And Tucker got stopped for a loss or no gain a few times too. Is your argument that he wasn't effective because he didn't gain yards on every single play? He averaged 3.3 yards per carry when you factor in the losses he took on the bad snaps. That's solid. Nobody is saying the guy is Lamar Jackson.

My arguement is that teams know now how to stop them. And I don’t think GS is a good enough passer to not get the box stacked on us to the point we throw for 100 yards and win in ACc Play

 

[kcsu]

Plus, the OL played well in the run game.

Spot on. Much better run blocking than pass protection. Schmidt has done a hell of a job.

 

[capeorange]

Except you can see those handoffs come a mile away with Tommy. Shrader did a much better job with misdirection of who had the ball, him or Tucker.

^^^^
This!

Tommy looks like he's not even trying to fake the hand off. He clearly hands the ball off then half heartedly waves his arm.

 

[kcsu]

My arguement is that teams know now how to stop them. And I don’t think GS is a good enough passer to not get the box stacked on us to the point we throw for 100 yards and win in ACc Play

I dont agree. He will improve over time. Kids hasn't played qb for close to 3 years.

 

[JRHEETER]

Look Devito wouldn’t have wrangled in HALF of those awful snaps from Servais.

GS is the better “in game” qb.

TD has the better arm and can make any throw….but when push comes to shove he can’t get the job done and move the team down the field.

GS needs to work on throws and I think he will. They looked rough but we’ve seen enough of TD to know that he just isn’t getting the job done.

GS went out and got the job done last night, but I wouldn’t say he “won” the competition..yet.

 

[FloridaFan]

I dont agree. He will improve over time. Kids hasn't played qb for close to 3 years.

As a fresh man he averaged like 110 yards passing. He just isn’t a passing QB really

 

[longislandcuse]

A lot of people seem to think TD still has a role on this team.

Maybe.. maybe Shrader simply can’t move the ball against ACC teams. But I’d rather give Shrader all the first team reps and try to develop some semblance of downfield passing game throughout the season, then flip back to Devito, who can only pass the ball down the field to open WRs from a clean pocket.

It might be ugly, but if Shrader can hit 1/4 deep balls, a few WR/RB screens and a handful of short/intermediate drag/curl routes… that might be enough with this running game.

 

[FloridaFan]

A lot of people seem to think TD still has a role on this team.

Maybe.. maybe Shrader simply can’t move the ball against ACC teams. But I’d rather give Shrader all the first team reps and try to develop some semblance of downfield passing game throughout the season, then flip back to Devito, who can only pass the ball down the field to open WRs from a clean pocket.

It might be ugly, but if Shrader can hit 1/4 deep balls, a few WR/RB screens and a handful of short/intermediate drag/curl routes… that might be enough with this running game.

I think they split reps still. That’s what they did this week dino said

 

[kcsu]

As a fresh man he averaged like 110 yards passing. He just isn’t a passing QB really

Neither was Eric. Very few dual threat Qbs are good at both. Shrader doesn’t need to be Namath he just needs to be adequate. Gilbert has to create a passing scheme that works for him. He will be ok. And he will improve.

 

[Scooch]

For whatever reasons, when it come to TD the whole is less than the sum of his parts. It’s been that way for 3 years. It happens, sometimes the 5-tool prospect washes out of the majors. And sometimes the unathletic guy with one or two great skills sticks around for years.

Shrader’s poor passing is going to kill us at some point, maybe as soon as next week. But maybe his legs will be a net positive. Ultimately that’s all we can hope for. Two flawed QBs, neither of whom are going to win us 10 games in their own. So we just gotta pick our poison and hope for the best.

 

[baggerbob]

Bingo we have a winner. Spot on. The idea is to open up the lanes for tucker. It doesn't matter if its vertical or horizontal. Because Shrader is a true threat to run as long as he can hit the horizontal and mid range throws we can move the ball.

If our OG ever decides to throw a few short passes to our 6-7, 265 lb TE, that might open things up a bit. With Rhino back that needs to happen. Only Alford, and Harris need to be in the game at WE, the others are terrible.

 

[Cuse'91]

If our OG ever decides to throw a few short passes to our 6-7, 265 lb TE, that might open things up a bit. With Rhino back that needs to happen. Only Alford, and Harris need to be in the game at WE, the others are terrible.

I like Gadsden too, out wide opposite Alford. Taj to slot full time a la Erv. Rhino at TE, or no TE and Adams with Tucker.

 

[HRE Otto IV]

For whatever reasons, when it come to TD the whole is less than the sum of his parts. It’s been that way for 3 years. It happens, sometimes the 5-tool prospect washes out of the majors. And sometimes the unathletic guy with one or two great skills sticks around for years.

Shrader’s poor passing is going to kill us at some point, maybe as soon as next week. But maybe his legs will be a net positive. Ultimately that’s all we can hope for. Two flawed QBs, neither of whom are going to win us 10 games in their own. So we just gotta pick our poison and hope for the best.

Sometimes it feels like Tommy is cursed. When it isn't his fault the OL messes up (blocking or penalty), or a WR drops a pass. When he is in something always seems to go wrong.

 

[Cuseregular]

How many wide open guys has TD missed? A lot

We took one shot down field with Shrader and he missed ... Y'all should be used to seeing a miss with TD

He hits one every 6-7 attempts

Edit:. TD is the one with the rep as the gunslinger, not Shrader. Ain't no gunslinging going on, on the hill since TD took over

I am not even sure he missed on that long ball, if Alford does not get illegally chucked in the middle of his route I think that pass is perfect. I’ll need to watch the replay to confirm this.

And on the long sideline pass completed Outabounds that is on the receiver to stay in bounds for the route. I think that ball was catchable inbounds, again gonna need to watch the replay. But if that is accurate then we’re not even talking about Schrader struggling to throw the ball.

 

[Cuseregular]

Sometimes it feels like Tommy is cursed. When it isn't his fault the OL messes up (blocking or penalty), or a WR drops a pass. When he is in something always seems to go wrong.

It’s called the undifineable and nebulous “it” quality. He does not have “it“.

 

[MikeSU02]

2-1 with a functional OL

The point was that TD has the arm for that throw and has done it a lot in his career. GS does a lot of other things well, but not that throw.

I think there are a lot of posters that will need to revaluate their positions on TD by the end of the season

"Revaluate their positions on TD by the end of the season"

Really? After his fifth year in the program. Honestly, I have never seen such leeway for a kid who has been given every opportunity to be QB1 who's best attribute is he can win the prize at the football toss at the carnival.

Tommy has been here more YEARS than GS has played games and we want to keep giving rope to Tommy.

I've literally never seen anything like this with any other player in my life.

 

[Cuse'91]

"Revaluate their positions on TD by the end of the season"

Really? After his fifth year in the program. Honestly, I have never seen such leeway for a kid who has been given every opportunity to be QB1 who's best attribute is he can win the prize at the football toss at the carnival.

Tommy has been here more YEARS than GS has played games and we want to keep giving rope to Tommy.

I've literally never seen anything like this with any other player in my life.

Sharod Johnson say hi.

 

[MikeSU02]

Sharod Johnson say hi.

Ha, I don't think fans are laying down on the tracks to defend Johnson still playing.

 

[AngryOtto]

I think they split reps still. That’s what they did this week dino said

That is a problem. Give GS all the 1st team reps.
Play calling is an issue.
Not sure why they don’t roll GS more out on passes.
No bubble screens because the wr on the field suck at blocking.

 

[AngryOtto]

The issue I have on O is DB seems to not want to rotate players at wr or rb. Tucker is awesome but they cannot continue to run him 30 times. Give Hatcher or one of the other wr a chance.