Ut oh - Babers dodged the "are u here for the long term question"

[blizz]

A few thoughts and observations to add:

There is one time Dino had laid his motives bare, imo, and I believe it was during his first appearance on Coaches Film Room during the 2016 National Championship. He said something to the effect that all he wants is the opportunity to win a national championship.

A decade ago that could be almost anywhere. The landscape is so different today and I think as things stand there are only a handful of schools that have the infrastructure, resources, and processes in place to win a Natty. Absent an elite program calling, you're left with having to build a program from scratch.

I've also noticed that the words 'national championship' have recently appeared in John Wildhack's informal talking points when articulating the progression of goals for our football program.

I'm certain the two points are totally unrelated.

 

[PhatOrange]

USC too. ND, of the 3, is the only one selling out consistently.

USC and Miami play in professionally sized stadiums that are usually 60% full.

yup. their stadiums are huge located in major metros and they're half empty.

missed USC my bad. #18 - 72K.

 

[SmilinBob]

Hes a west coast guy. The fill the Dome thing is total Bull. Offer him a significant raise as well as his staff. SU has plenty of money. We could double salaries and it is at best a rounding error. If he wins the fans will be there 40k strong every game. Its not about attendance.

KC...Ask the recruits if it is or isn't. It is a battle uphill to sell the program, especially having 3 4-8's in a row.
Babers is selling the academics and other things right now while waiting for this attendance to pick up. If it does...we may be in good shape but if it continues to lag and recruits continue to say no out of hand or come and see 28 to 37K well...how long will he continue to fight this battle?

 

[310Pigpen]

Dino is after accolades, not $. If Syracuse can give him what he needs to compete at the highest level he will be here for a long time.

 

[cuse309]

Think this thread is premature. However, in spite of knowing it's early and that anything can happen, I'm not seeing many, if any top jobs, opening this offseason. Would he leave for a lateral move to a place like Maryland or Texas Tech?

He's just waiting for that Hawaii job to open up.

 

[cuse309]

Would you guys rather win and risk losing Dino, or lose and rest assured we still have Dino?

 

[IthacaBarrel]

Would you guys rather win and risk losing Dino, or lose and rest assured we still have Dino?

Sometimes you have to wonder and Dino has plenty of work to do to put him on the market for a new job.

 

[Shrmdougluvr]

The Dome looked ok, and sounded pretty good with just under 38k fans last Saturday. I could see us averaging that amount next year, if we can get to a bowl this season. Piggy back that with 7-5 or 8-4 (very doable in 2019) and you could have consistent attendance in the upper 30k, low 40k range. That's really competitive for a school like SU. We also dont know who is reporting butts in the seats vs tickets sold, and how much playing close to massive football factory schools influences attendance in terms of visiting fans.

Schools i consider to be similar (localized fans with national alumni; private; similar enrollments) drew as follows in 2017 (SU averaged 33,929):

1. Miami = 58,662;
2. Stanford = 47,398;
3. TCU = 44,080;
4. Baylor = 43,830;
5. BC = 35,924;
6. Northwestern = 35,853;
7. Vandy = 31,341
8. Duke = 26,796.

"Regional" Rivals:

1. Louisville = 46,160;
2. Rutgers = 39,749;
3. Maryland = 39,643;
4. UVA = 39,398; and
5. Pitt = 36,295.

Regional schools (insight into Northeast football culture):

1. UConn = 20,335;
2. Buffalo = 13,350; and
3. UMass = 10,707.

 

[upperdeck]

UL on a friday will draw if we are still playing well.. NC st being ranked would be a decent draw.. play well the next 3 weeks and get to the UNC 5-1 and the hype will be pretty big for the UNC game with 2 weeks to promote it and homecoming followed by parents weekend vs NC st, we could push close to 40 for the last 3 home games. UL has some name cache and payback coming for many.

 

[storange]

The $$$$
"It says your worth it" Money Ball

 

[storange]

The Dome looked ok, and sounded pretty good with just under 38k fans last Saturday. I could see us averaging that amount next year, if we can get to a bowl this season. Piggy back that with 7-5 or 8-4 (very doable in 2019) and you could have consistent attendance in the upper 30k, low 40k range. That's really competitive for a school like SU. We also dont know who is reporting butts in the seats vs tickets sold, and how much playing close to massive football factory schools influences attendance in terms of visiting fans.

Schools i consider to be similar (localized fans with national alumni; private; similar enrollments) drew as follows in 2017 (SU averaged 33,929):

1. Miami = 58,662;
2. Stanford = 47,398;
3. TCU = 44,080;
4. Baylor = 43,830;
5. BC = 35,924;
6. Northwestern = 35,853;
7. Vandy = 31,341
8. Duke = 26,796.

"Regional" Rivals:

1. Louisville = 46,160;
2. Rutgers = 39,749;
3. Maryland = 39,643;
4. UVA = 39,398; and
5. Pitt = 36,295.

Regional schools (insight into Northeast football culture):

1. UConn = 20,335;
2. Buffalo = 13,350; and
3. UMass = 10,707.

40% of Northwestern #s are opponents fans.

 

[CusefanATL]

Week 4 press conference... tell me I'm just being paranoid

Dino Babers will be 58 before the start of next college football season.

Willie Taggart is destroying FSU to build them back. Babers doesnt have time like that. Too risky for a bigger fish.

My level of worry is only a 9.5.

 

[Capt. Tuttle]

Exactly and it’s why I’m can’t understand why seats aren’t cheaper, and feels like they nickel and dime on the cost of the seat. Cheaper seats = more butts = more concessions and merchandise sales.

Cheaper seats won't mean more Fannie's, if the product is poor, the food is bad, the experience stinks, and the hosting staff (ushers) are rude. All of that must improve. (Caveat- I haven't been to a FB game since Doug's debut).

 

[Capt. Tuttle]

40% of Northwestern #s are opponents fans.

That's the big 10 fans, with their 50's era attachment to state U, doing the traveling. Outside of ND, VT and Clemson, you won't see that in the ACC.

 

[CuseOnly]

That's not the point. Some place that will pay 4 mil plus is mega type school.

Not really, I wouldn't consider UTAH a "mega type school" and they pay their coach $3.7 with almost $1 mil in incentives.

The 25 highest-paid coaches in college football

Look at the list and see how much you think Dino is worth. I think if we can't or won't pay him around $4 mil then he is most likely going to leave eventually.

 

[Trueblue25]

Anyone catch how upset Dino seemed at the thought of adding AC to the dome? Thought it was hilarious

 

[elimunelson]

Not really, I wouldn't consider UTAH a "mega type school" and they pay their coach $3.7 with almost $1 mil in incentives.

The 25 highest-paid coaches in college football

Look at the list and see how much you think Dino is worth. I think if we can't or won't pay him around $4 mil then he is most likely going to leave eventually.

i can't imagine Syracuse will pony up 4mm for a HC. You still have to pay the assistants too so you're talking another what, 1.5-2mm?

The school is a private/northeastern university with a finite amount of money in the coffers. Someone can correct me but do we have an active football boosters group who will also kick in cash as well?

So yes, he'll leave for money like I said 100 messages ago. The attendance stuff is nonsense. It's all about money, not prestige or seats.

 

[UGHV]

Sorry it wont be about attendance.

There have been multiple comments from Dino and the rest of the coaching staff, both publicly and privately, regarding being frustrated with attendance. I got the feeling that they were almost "shocked" with how difficult it's been to convince people to come out to the games.

Obviously "if you win, they will come". I am hopeful that we have a positive season the rest of the way and next year is our coming out party. Attendance will hopefully greatly improve by then and that will convince Dino to stick around for the long haul. If that's the case, then we have ACC Championships and a jam-packed, renovated Dome in our future!

 

[CuseCrew08]

I hope that ADJW takes the opportunity with the dome renovation to completely revamp the pricing structure of the dome seating. I feel ticket prices should be decreased in order to get more butts in seats. We shall see, in Wildhack I trust!

 

[Finwad32]

I think the pricing model between the 30’s in the 3rd tier are really the only ones in need of serious revamping.

 

[721Comstock]

The Dome looked ok, and sounded pretty good with just under 38k fans last Saturday. I could see us averaging that amount next year, if we can get to a bowl this season. Piggy back that with 7-5 or 8-4 (very doable in 2019) and you could have consistent attendance in the upper 30k, low 40k range. That's really competitive for a school like SU. We also dont know who is reporting butts in the seats vs tickets sold, and how much playing close to massive football factory schools influences attendance in terms of visiting fans.

Schools i consider to be similar (localized fans with national alumni; private; similar enrollments) drew as follows in 2017 (SU averaged 33,929):

1. BC = 35,924;
2. Northwestern = 35,853;
3. Vandy = 31,341
4. Duke = 26,796.

"Regional" Rivals:

1. Louisville = 46,160;
2. Rutgers = 39,749;
3. Maryland = 39,643;
4. UVA = 39,398; and
5. Pitt = 36,295.

Regional schools (insight into Northeast football culture):

1. UConn = 20,335;
2. Buffalo = 13,350; and
3. UMass = 10,707.

I deleted the first 4 (or whatever) schools that are more like Football Factories than we'll likely ever be.
Our attendance is right in line with the 4 now listed there.

As for the "Regional" Rivals - you can bet the ranch on attendance dropping like a hot rock at all 5 of those this year, and likely next as well.
So, if we creep up a bit, and those expected dropoffs occur, then we're right up at/near the top of attendance vs. that cohort of programs.

 

[Trueblue25]

45,000 in the dome is a greater home field advantage in a superior conference than 65,000-75,000 at USC in the pac 12.

 

[CuseOnly]

i can't imagine Syracuse will pony up 4mm for a HC. You still have to pay the assistants too so you're talking another what, 1.5-2mm?

The school is a private/northeastern university with a finite amount of money in the coffers. Someone can correct me but do we have an active football boosters group who will also kick in cash as well?

So yes, he'll leave for money like I said 100 messages ago. The attendance stuff is nonsense. It's all about money, not prestige or seats.

That is top 25 money, if we want a top 25 team and a top 25 coach to keep us there, we are going to have to pony up.

Period.

If we don't want to be in the top 25, don't want a top 25 coach, then don't pay top 25 money.

It's science.

And that link is from 2017, 4 or 5 of those coaches have already moved on and are making more money than that, so the bottom of the top 25 has actually gone up.

The highest paid coaches in college football

Taggart $5.1
Patterson $5.0
Gundy $5.0
Frost $5.0
Petersen $4.37
Muschamp $4.2
Fuente $4.0
Petrino $3.93
Pruitt $3.81
Stoops $3.75

The question becomes, would Dino be attractive to the schools above that aren't having success with their current coaches. I would guess the answer is yes based on his track record of success.

They all would gladly pay him more for a turnaround.

Maybe it is attractive to him to see if his system works in the SEC. Maybe he likes challenges. Maybe he doesn't like the way he is supported. Maybe, maybe, maybe.

All factors.

 

[Alsacs]

That is top 25 money, if we want a top 25 team and a top 25 coach to keep us there, we are going to have to pony up.

Period.

If we don't want to be in the top 25, don't want a top 25 coach, then don't pay top 25 money.

It's science.

And that link is from 2017, 4 or 5 of those coaches have already moved on and are making more money than that, so the bottom of the top 25 has actually gone up.

The highest paid coaches in college football

Taggart $5.1
Patterson $5.0
Gundy $5.0
Frost $5.0
Petersen $4.37
Muschamp $4.2
Fuente $4.0
Petrino $3.93
Pruitt $3.81
Stoops $3.75

The question becomes, would Dino be attractive to the schools above that aren't having success with their current coaches. I would guess the answer is yes based on his track record of success.

They all would gladly pay him more for a turnaround.

Maybe it is attractive to him to see if his system works in the SEC. Maybe he likes challenges. Maybe he doesn't like the way he is supported. Maybe, maybe, maybe.

All factors.

BC only pays Steve Addazio 2.75 million per year.
SU pays Dino 2.4 million per year.

SU can clearly bump Dino up to high 3 million/low 4 million per year.

Dino isn’t going to leave for money.
He would leave for a factory. He isn’t leaving Syracuse for Kentucky or Arkansas just because they are SEC.

He would leave for a good spot he could win a NC not Illinois, Georgia Tech or North Carolina.

If USC opened up or Auburn opened up he could be interested there.
He isn’t leaving for a lateral type job like Georgia Tech or North Carolina.

 

[UnknownOrange]

That is top 25 money, if we want a top 25 team and a top 25 coach to keep us there, we are going to have to pony up.

Period.

If we don't want to be in the top 25, don't want a top 25 coach, then don't pay top 25 money.

It's science.

And that link is from 2017, 4 or 5 of those coaches have already moved on and are making more money than that, so the bottom of the top 25 has actually gone up.

The highest paid coaches in college football

Taggart $5.1
Patterson $5.0
Gundy $5.0
Frost $5.0
Petersen $4.37
Muschamp $4.2
Fuente $4.0
Petrino $3.93
Pruitt $3.81
Stoops $3.75

The question becomes, would Dino be attractive to the schools above that aren't having success with their current coaches. I would guess the answer is yes based on his track record of success.

They all would gladly pay him more for a turnaround.

Maybe it is attractive to him to see if his system works in the SEC. Maybe he likes challenges. Maybe he doesn't like the way he is supported. Maybe, maybe, maybe.

All factors.

That list just reminds me that John Wildhack and Gus Malzahn were separated at birth