“I don’t care about the record…” - Jim Boeheim

[Dave]

A number of the responses just sum up the same whiny arguments that've been there all season.

My Syracuse isn’t winning. It’s because of the way they’re coached. The coach’s sons. No man to man. JFC, how much worse is your life because we had the first losing season in 50 years?

The guy who literally designed, built and managed those 50 years enjoyed coaching his sons, get the pitchforks! I’m happy JB got that, I’m happy his sons got that. He deserves it, especially at this point in his career.

I cheered when I was there. I cheered when I watched. I’ll cheer again next year and the year after that.

Thank you! Someone who gets it.

 

[Day2]

I'll say again, college basketball isn't college football. To me, in hoops, losing close doesn't mean a whole lot.

Georgetown lost to Seton Hall by 7 and 5 this year. Lost to UConn by 9. Lost to Villanova by 11 and 8.

Were they "competitive"?

Are we seriously arguing over the definition of competitive? Competitive doesn’t mean you win all of the games. No, that’s dominance. Competitive means you’re in a position to win the games, but don’t win them all.

We’re not competitive with elite teams right now, we all agree on that. Obviously we’re competitive with the next tier. Not just the teams we beat like Indiana, Wake, and FSU. You can lose a close game and be competitive, whether it’s because you built up a big lead, or because the game went to overtime, or because you missed a last second shot.

Ask Larranaga if we’re competitive. Or Hubert Davis. This is just silly. You’re basically saying we’re not competitive with UNC because Caleb Love hit a three towards the end of regulation. Don’t be ridiculous.

 

[Scooch]

Are we seriously arguing over the definition of competitive? Competitive doesn’t mean you win all of the games. No, that’s dominance. Competitive means you’re in a position to win the games, but don’t win them all.

We’re not competitive with elite teams right now, we all agree on that. Obviously we’re competitive with the next tier. Not just the teams we beat like Indiana, Wake, and FSU. You can lose a close game and be competitive, whether it’s because you built up a big lead, or because the game went to overtime, or because you missed a last second shot.

Ask Larranaga if we’re competitive. Or Hubert Davis. This is just silly. You’re basically saying we’re not competitive with UNC because Caleb Love hit a three towards the end of regulation. Don’t be ridiculous.

I was hesitant to post that because I hate debating terms. It just goes sideways as everyone tries to define things.

I’ll put it this way… I find playing teams close less compelling when it’s used as predictor of how a team might fare in the future in college hoops. And that’s because a high percentage of college basketball games are decided by a relatively small margin. Over the course of a season the good teams win a bunch of those ~5 point games, or OT games, while the mediocre teams lose a bunch of them.

So when we play UNC close it doesn’t signal to me that all we need to do is fix X, Y and Z and then we’ll get them next year.

Just my 2 cents. Man, people get really ornery about this stuff.

 

[tbonezone]

I was hesitant to post that because I hate debating terms. It just goes sideways as everyone tries to define things.

I’ll put it this way… I find playing teams close less compelling when it’s used as predictor of how a team might fare in the future in college hoops. And that’s because a high percentage of college basketball games are decided by a relatively small margin. Over the course of a season the good teams win a bunch of those ~5 point games, or OT games, while the mediocre teams lose a bunch of them.

So when we play UNC close it doesn’t signal to me that all we need to do is fix X, Y and Z and then we’ll get them next year.

Just my 2 cents. Man, people get really ornery about this stuff.

i don't get ACC network .rather i listen on the radio while doing something productive . if a game ends close i'll catch the condensed version on YOUTUBE later to see what happened . blowouts i don't bother. such a better use of my time and energy.

 

[Day2]

I was hesitant to post that because I hate debating terms. It just goes sideways as everyone tries to define things.

I’ll put it this way… I find playing teams close less compelling when it’s used as predictor of how a team might fare in the future in college hoops. And that’s because a high percentage of college basketball games are decided by a relatively small margin. Over the course of a season the good teams win a bunch of those ~5 point games, or OT games, while the mediocre teams lose a bunch of them.

So when we play UNC close it doesn’t signal to me that all we need to do is fix X, Y and Z and then we’ll get them next year.

Just my 2 cents. Man, people get really ornery about this stuff.

OK…so now it’s about next year. Cool.

 

[baggerbob]

Still if we'd won 3-4 of those games we might still have a shot at the NCAAs and would have clinched another winning record. I think the conversation would have a slightly different tone. Someone posted that we don't have the personnel to compete with the teams we are playing. We actually competed with them fairly well. We just didn't make the plays at the end to win those games.

Steve look at the entire record, the first 38 years, JB had 4 years with 13 or more losses. The last 8 years JB has had 7 years with 13 or more losses.
Something is wrong with the program, and in the final analysis as Harry Truman said "The buck stops here".
JB is the head coach, so the downturn of the program is his. The facts show the program isn't in a good place.

 

[SWC75]

And Jimmy?

Thanks.

And Benny? If he'd lived up to the hype, Jimmy would have been our 6th man.

 

[syrBossHogg]

How many times did the Big East only send 4 teams to the tourney, with only one of those teams ranked? We use to snicker at teams like Duke/UNC for playing soft conferences and now we're sitting here trying to justify teams with 8/9 losses like WF/ND and a down UNC team as good teams.

I tend to be an optimist but this year was a clear step down from probably even our 17/18 and 18/19 teams. It was a bad ACC season

 

[SWC75]

Steve look at the entire record, the first 38 years, JB had 4 years with 13 or more losses. The last 8 years JB has had 7 years with 13 or more losses.
Something is wrong with the program, and in the final analysis as Harry Truman said "The buck stops here".
JB is the head coach, so the downturn of the program is his. The facts show the program isn't in a good place.

Yes, we've been in a rut. This was a bad season by Syracuse standards. And JB;'s the coach, so it's on him. He wouldn't disagree. He's trying to pull us out of that rut. A change of philosophy and a 6 man class might do it. if not, it will be up to the next guy.

 

[SWC75]

I was hesitant to post that because I hate debating terms. It just goes sideways as everyone tries to define things.

I’ll put it this way… I find playing teams close less compelling when it’s used as predictor of how a team might fare in the future in college hoops. And that’s because a high percentage of college basketball games are decided by a relatively small margin. Over the course of a season the good teams win a bunch of those ~5 point games, or OT games, while the mediocre teams lose a bunch of them.

So when we play UNC close it doesn’t signal to me that all we need to do is fix X, Y and Z and then we’ll get them next year.

Just my 2 cents. Man, people get really ornery about this stuff.

The issue I was addressing was a statement that we don't have the talent to compete against the teams we are playing. We do. Nobody's saying that that is enough.

 

[Alsacs]

And Benny? If he'd lived up to the hype, Jimmy would have been our 6th man.

Yeah I didn’t drink the kool aid hype on Benny.

Benny Williams

Might be the least talked about top 35 recruit ever on the board. Seems like there's quite a few fans who gloss over him when discussing next year, which I am surprised considering so many people complained we missed on these players in previous years.

syracusefan.com

Jimmy’s stats you are responding to where part of the plan.
Go ask Quincy G what he thinks of the HC. You would be shocked

 

[tbonezone]

The issue I was addressing was a statement that we don't have the talent to compete against the teams we are playing. We do. Nobody's saying that that is enough.

bottom line is the dude is 77. he ain't changing. time for pickle ball not D1 hoops.

 

[SWC75]

Disagree. Those are some distortions. JAB thought he could win with this team, which heavily featured his sons and some players that he was familiar with from his sons' AAU days. That wasn't an accident or a coincidence.

Cole Swider was the #44 recruit in his class, Symir Torrance #75 and Benny Williams #32. They were more than "some players that he was familiar with from his sons' AAU days". I suspect the majority of players that come out of the transfer portal are guys their new coaches were familiar with from having recruited them before. I don't believe that Jim wanted Guerrier, Grifin, Braswell, Newton and Richmond to leave. Nor do I believe that he would start doing things that he knew would injure the Syracuse basketball program after having done nothing but try to build it up for 60 years.

 

[SWC75]

Yeah I didn’t drink the kool aid hype on Benny.

Benny Williams

Might be the least talked about top 35 recruit ever on the board. Seems like there's quite a few fans who gloss over him when discussing next year, which I am surprised considering so many people complained we missed on these players in previous years.

syracusefan.com

Jimmy’s stats you are responding to where part of the plan.
Go ask Quincy G what he thinks of the HC. You would be shocked

247 does Cool Aid Hype?

 

[CuseFaninVT]

Yeah I didn’t drink the kool aid hype on Benny.

Benny Williams

Might be the least talked about top 35 recruit ever on the board. Seems like there's quite a few fans who gloss over him when discussing next year, which I am surprised considering so many people complained we missed on these players in previous years.

syracusefan.com

Jimmy’s stats you are responding to where part of the plan.
Go ask Quincy G what he thinks of the HC. You would be shocked

I would like to learn more

 

[tbonezone]

if he's (benny) a major talent why is he playing 3 minutes a game ? not like we're loaded with first rounders. explain the 10 minutes or less games . poor execution or evaluation? i'd guess latter. dude should have seen 20 all season.

 

[djcon57]

Cole Swider was the #44 recruit in his class, Symir Torrance #75 and Benny Williams #32. They were more than "some players that he was familiar with from his sons' AAU days". I suspect the majority of players that come out of the transfer portal are guys their new coaches were familiar with from having recruited them before. I don't believe that Jim wanted Guerrier, Grifin, Braswell, Newton and Richmond to leave. Nor do I believe that he would start doing things that he knew would injure the Syracuse basketball program after having done nothing but try to build it up for 60 years.

Symir Torrance, #75, was a guy who could barely get off the bench for two bad Marquette teams and now he's a guy who could barely get off the bench for another sub 500 team. Maybe we want to stop leaning on that 75. Explained this to you preseason as well, but you didnt listen then

 

[Day2]

Yeah I didn’t drink the kool aid hype on Benny.

Benny Williams

Might be the least talked about top 35 recruit ever on the board. Seems like there's quite a few fans who gloss over him when discussing next year, which I am surprised considering so many people complained we missed on these players in previous years.

syracusefan.com

Jimmy’s stats you are responding to where part of the plan.
Go ask Quincy G what he thinks of the HC. You would be shocked

 

[Alsacs]

View attachment 215334

As long as JB is HC for the rest of his career I will be from your home state and need to see it to believe it.
I get plenty wrong and own it. SWC just made it appear like everyone expected Benny to put up good numbers.
I didn’t believe the hype because I use my eyes. You will find plenty i get wrong see Elijah Hughes.
I was playing in a poker tournament on the same table with Dasher when Elijah Hughes committed and I told him I didn’t like it because of his shooting numbers. I was wrong on that one. He told me trusted the staff.
He was right.

 

[Day2]

As long as JB is HC for the rest of his career I will be from your home state and need to see it to believe it.
I get plenty wrong and own it. SWC just made it appear like everyone expected Benny to put up good numbers.
I didn’t believe the hype because I use my eyes. You will find plenty i get wrong see Elijah Hughes.
I was playing in a poker tournament on the same table with Dasher when Elijah Hughes committed and I told him I didn’t like it because of his shooting numbers. I was wrong on that one. He told me trusted the staff.
He was right.

So you’re competitive.

 

[SWC75]

if he's (benny) a major talent why is he playing 3 minutes a game ? not like we're loaded with first rounders. explain the 10 minutes or less games . poor execution or evaluation? i'd guess latter. dude should have seen 20 all season.

Because he's bene a huge disappointment. That doesn't mean he was recruited because he'd be no threat to Jimmy.

 

[SWC75]

Symir Torrance, #75, was a guy who could barely get off the bench for two bad Marquette teams and now he's a guy who could barely get off the bench for another sub 500 team. Maybe we want to stop leaning on that 75. Explained this to you preseason as well, but you didnt listen then

That still doesn't mean that he was recruited because he'd be no threat to the Boeheims. Most people want to see more of him.

 

[djcon57]

That still doesn't mean that he was recruited because he'd be no threat to the Boeheims. Most people want to see more of him.

the boeheims? No.
joe? Yes.

reminder that you said this in April of last year

”So...per 2-4-7, we've lost Kadari Richmond (#88 coming out of high school), John Bol Ajak (#480) and Robert Braswell (Unrated) and gotten Symir Torrence, (#75), Cole Swider (#44) to go with Benny Williams, (#25)?

Sounds like a an upgrade to me.”

 

[RF2044]

The issue I was addressing was a statement that we don't have the talent to compete against the teams we are playing. We do. Nobody's saying that that is enough.

So, you're claiming that we have the talent to compete -- and yet we couldn't meet the minimum threshold to qualify for the NIT tournament? We couldn't produce a winning record? We couldn't attain a record above .500 in the worst group of teams the ACC conference has fielded since last century?

Setting aside those measurable, completely non-subjective indicators of whether we were competitive or not, how did you and Mrs. Lincoln enjoy the play, SWC?

Despite your pollyannish insistence otherwise, this roster lacked talent. What we had in actuality was a group of shooters who could occasionally get streaky hot, and when that infrequently happened they were tough. And when it didn't, they couldn't hang. There's a big difference between "good" and "good enough," and from your posts in this thread, you clearly don't recognize the difference.

 

[rrlbees]

Yeah I didn’t drink the kool aid hype on Benny.

Benny Williams

Might be the least talked about top 35 recruit ever on the board. Seems like there's quite a few fans who gloss over him when discussing next year, which I am surprised considering so many people complained we missed on these players in previous years.

syracusefan.com

Jimmy’s stats you are responding to where part of the plan.
Go ask Quincy G what he thinks of the HC. You would be shocked

Yea, the ncaa moved the nba decision date from April to July. JB didn’t want to potentially wait that long and told him. If Q had waited till the summer (which he didn’t in the end) we wouldn’t have gotten a replacement at that late date. We had this discussion in the spring. Do you not remember in March JB building him up as an AA?