Cooney Debate/Criticism/Discussion Containment Thread

[Cusefan0307]

Sarcasm alert: It's a good thing Cooney occupies so many defenders, otherwise Rak wouldn't have gotten room for his tonite and G would never have been able to get off a shot on his own. And, for sure Roberson would never have seen the ball without the room Cooney made for him by missing 9 in a row.

Cooney's 19 for 78 from three in his last 10 games, that's a whopping 24 percent and inching closer to Patterson territory. It's one thing to have a young player perform so poorly, it's quite another to have a veteran who obviously can't do it (remember last year?) still trying so hard to do things he can't do. His supporters keep saying how hard he's defended and that he plays his butt off but it's more that the defenders at this level totally over match him and he's unable to adjust.

One of John Wooden's axioms is "Don't mistake activity for achievement." Cooney's play in most of this year's games is a good example of just that. Runs around and around but infrequently produces positive results.

Personally, I'd rather see a whole lot more of Patterson--better defense, better athlete, better feet, better handle, more aggressive getting in the lane, just more productive. And, sadly, an equally bad shooter. But his positives outweigh Cooney's right now. Limit Cooney to 20 minutes and if he starts to chuck outside the offense, sit him.

Patterson gave up three cherry picking lay ups because he didn't get back on defense.

 

[STEVEHOLT]

Stop with the 35 footers early in the clock

stop with the head down, NFL running back unsuccessful dives to the rim on fast breaks.

all will be well.

 

[NineOneSeven]

What ... we just played our best game of the year... and you want to start the 510th thread of the season about Cooney. Give it a break!

Why?

 

[NineOneSeven]

Was anyone at all shocked when cooney took the fast break himself to the hoop and left the layup short?

I'll say it again- I'm a big cooney supporter but he has NOT played well at all recently. Offensively, defensively, doesn't matter. Not ripping him, just presenting my opinion.

 

[Ghost]

Patterson gave up three cherry picking lay ups because he didn't get back on defense.

Hmmm, at least one of those was when Cooney took a 40 foot jumper from the top of the key - and then reacted late and tried to run in and grab the long rebound, which he didn't. Not sure that's on Patterson. I think another one as well, but honestly not too sure on the other ones...

 

[kcsu]

Trevor is the most over rated player in the history of Syracuse basketball. He hustles, he is a solid leader who plays decent D but as a shooter and O player he is average at best. The fact that many on this board hold him in such high regard is beyond me. The kid is average at best and chokes in big games.

 

[tee1222]

Never give up

 

[Ghost]

Never give up

So positive! Keep on, keeping on, Tee.

 

[mayselc]

We didn't have a lot of offensive options for much of this year, so I'll give him a pass on much of his shot selection and selfish-looking play. But next year will determine if his career at Syracuse is remembered highly. With a talented class coming in and a lot of developing players coming back (so far), I'd like to see him take better shots and have a Kueth Duany type of year. 30 minutes a game or less and 40-45% from three with <6 attempts per game.

 

[tee1222]

So positive! Keep on, keeping on, Tee.

You know I can do this!

 

[NineOneSeven]

You know I can do this!

Such a prayer

 

[kjb120]

Trevor is the most over rated player in the history of Syracuse basketball. He hustles, he is a solid leader who plays decent D but as a shooter and O player he is average at best. The fact that many on this board hold him in such high regard is beyond me. The kid is average at best and chokes in big games.

This won't go over well on here, I'm not sure he's the most overrated player in our history but he definitely is overrated by some on this board.

 

[kcsu]

Was anyone at all shocked when cooney took the fast break himself to the hoop and left the layup short?

I'll say it again- I'm a big cooney supporter but he has NOT played well at all recently. Offensively, defensively, doesn't matter. Not ripping him, just presenting my opinion.

Do you know him or his family? If not why are you and so many others a huge supporter of Trevor? Im sure that he is a great kid but the support that he gets as a player isnt deserved. He is playing 40 a game because there isnt much to supplant him. If you look at his production he is pedestrian at best.

I love the kid because he is always playing hard, is a true leader and seems to pick up the young guys when JB is kicking them in the nuts. For this i think he is special. But if you look just at his bball skills and production he is average.

 

[NineOneSeven]

Do you know him or his family? If not why are you and so many others a huge supporter of Trevor? Im sure that he is a great kid but the support that he gets as a player isnt deserved. He is playing 40 a game because there isnt much to supplant him. If you look at his production he is pedestrian at best.

I love the kid because he is always playing hard, is a true leader and seems to pick up the young guys when JB is kicking them in the nuts. For this i think he is special. But if you look just at his bball skills and production he is average.

I'm a supporter because I recognize his importance to the team.

There's a difference between that and blindly excusing his play.

 

[OttoinGrotto]

I think it's time to accept that he's a 33% three point shooter.

 

[Ghost]

here we go

it's worth talking about. especially considering that the offense took off as soon as he stopped shooting

Concur. The whole forum is pretty much debating this stuff anyway. It's what we do for fun! Of course we're all thrilled we won, now we post in the happy threads how happy we are, and in less happy ones - we argue. It's nothing new.

I still think it's just worth discussing in the context of the ongoing debate though - as Millhouse says above. A lot of people have put forth the theory that Cooney has to shoot for this team to be successful. That Cooney has to play 40 minutes for this team to be successful.

It seems like he just plays 40 because it was pre-ordained.

Rak is our most important player - he can sit out 2 minutes and the team doesn't crumble. It's happened two games in a row.

In the last game Cooney sat out Pitt was on a 7-1 run when he exited, Cooney checked out and we went on an 8-2 run, Cooney checked back in and Pitt went on an 8-0 run.

Cooney could take a breather at times. Cooney wasn't being endlessly face-guarded tonight the other big reason he struggles, and yes, he missed some shots he normally might make, but his game remained largely unchanged. We didn't see him change anything up - going to the rim and dishing the ball, scoring at the rim, etc...it was nice that he stopped shooting though at the end so we could get Rak the ball. That restraint was a positive.

I don't know. I'm still unclear as to why he can't take a blow when he's tired, or makes the same mistakes that calls for an immediate benching for numerous other players (i.e. closing out but not challenging the shooter, not getting back, allowing penetration like it's his second job, horrible decisions on fast breaks, etc...) Que, sera, sera...

 

[kcsu]

Concur. The whole forum is pretty much debating this stuff anyway. It's what we do for fun! Of course we're all thrilled we won, now we post in the happy threads how happy we are, and in less happy ones - we argue. It's nothing new.

I still think it's just worth discussing in the context of the ongoing debate though - as Millhouse says above. A lot of people have put forth the theory that Cooney has to shoot for this team to be successful. That Cooney has to play 40 minutes for this team to be successful.

It seems like he just plays 40 because it was pre-ordained.

Rak is our most important player - he can sit out 2 minutes and the team doesn't crumble. It's happened two games in a row.

In the last game Cooney sat out Pitt was on a 7-1 run when he exited, Cooney checked out and we went on an 8-2 run, Cooney checked back in and Pitt went on an 8-0 run.

Cooney could take a breather at times. Cooney wasn't being endlessly face-guarded tonight the other big reason he struggles, and yes, he missed some shots he normally might make, but his game remained largely unchanged. We didn't see him change anything up - going to the rim and dishing the ball, scoring at the rim, etc...it was nice that he stopped shooting though at the end so we could get Rak the ball. That restraint was a positive.

I don't know. I'm still unclear as to why he can't take a blow when he's tired, or makes the same mistakes that calls for an immediate benching for numerous other players (i.e. closing out but not challenging the shooter, not getting back, allowing penetration like it's his second job, horrible decisions on fast breaks, etc...) Que, sera, sera...

Good post. I think that Trevor should be playing less lets say 30 a game

 

[OttoinGrotto]

Kid busts his ass. That's whatni care about most.

That actually makes me uncomfortable. I have the expectation that for the most part all of our kids are working hard.

Guys can work hard, doesn't mean they don't play well or smart sometimes.

 

[CuseCPT]

JB said pretty much the same during his presser. Commented maybe he can only make the tough shots.
But also said it was probably his worst night of his SU career but he'll be back.

Yet he played 40 minutes lol. Whatever. Cooney could do modern interpretive dance at mid court and still get 40 minutes. It's almost comical now.

 

[Shark58]

i wish i coulda retired this after last year

 

[anomander]

It looked like he was in his own head tonight. The kid has been playing 40 mins a game, and those are a stressful 40 mins full of moving off the ball trying like hell to get open. I know people don't like to go down this road, but is it a coincidence that he starts to struggle in the 2nd half of the season after playing major minutes?

 

[STEVEHOLT]

I hope his chucker pass gets revoked next year when we have actual talent and a chance to go deep.

 

[Shark58]

It looked like he was in his own head tonight. The kid has been playing 40 mins a game, and those are a stressful 40 mins full of moving off the ball trying like hell to get open. I know people don't like to go down this road, but is it a coincidence that he starts to struggle in the 2nd half of the season after playing major minutes?

I agree 100%, but if it happens again next year at the expense of Mal's burn I'm gonna be really pissed

 

[Alsacs]

My buddy who I watched this game with is a wrestling fan and not a big hoops fan. He was asking me why I was frustrated with Cooney and I said he has tenure with the staff and while he is a good player isn't consistent enough to earn a green light from the staff.
He Told me then basically Trevor Cooney = John Cena of SU hoops. Both guys are lighting rods and have fans divided.

 

[OttoinGrotto]

I hope his chucker pass gets revoked next year when we have actual talent and a chance to go deep.

He's likely going to end up in 2nd or 3rd in the school all-time threes made list.

Question is, how many shots is it going to take to get him there.:noidea: