Is the program in a worse spot then when Dino took over?

[kcsu]

Better but ONLY because of the infrastructure improvements.
Our facilities are light years better which will provide the next coach with a significant advantage vs what Shaf and Dino had when he started.
The on field product isn't any better. The coaching is arguably worse.

 

[sufandu]

I am really surprised at the people that don't think we're better at running back. It only takes one series to see that Sean Tucker is a better runner as a freshman than Strickland or Neal were as seniors. They were probably better at the aspects by the time they seniors, but Tucker will improve there as well. Strickland and Neal could get whatever yards the oline gave them. Tucker consistently gets more than just what the oline gives, and he probably doesn't even play if we don't have opt outs.

Don't let the poor results of the team cloud the judgement of individual performances.

 

[Newhouser]

I am really surprised at the people that don't think we're better at running back. It only takes one series to see that Sean Tucker is a better runner as a freshman than Strickland or Neal were as seniors. They were probably better at the aspects by the time they seniors, but Tucker will improve there as well. Strickland and Neal could get whatever yards the oline gave them. Tucker consistently gets more than just what the oline gives, and he probably doesn't even play if we don't have opt outs.

Don't let the poor results of the team cloud the judgement of individual performances.

One back vs two both of whom were pretty talented and durable. I like Tucker. Let's see him stay healthy and make an impact against a good team before we give him 44.

 

[sufandu]

One back vs two both of whom were pretty talented and durable. I like Tucker. Let's see him stay healthy and make an impact against a good team before we give him 44.

You're comparing an opt out year to non-opt out years. If Lewis is better than either of them, certainly the presence of Adams and Howard means better depth. I actually like both of them more than Strickland and Neal too. Add in Jordan, and we have more depth and explosive potential than we've had at the position in a long time.

Who said anything about giving anyone 44? By the way, how many carries did Neal and Strickland get as true freshman?

 

[HRE Otto IV]

You're comparing an opt out year to non-opt out years. If Lewis is better than either of them, certainly the presence of Adams and Howard means better depth. I actually like both of them more than Strickland and Neal too. Add in Jordan, and we have more depth and explosive potential than we've had at the position in a long time.

Who said anything about giving anyone 44? By the way, how many carries did Neal and Strickland get as true freshman?

Strickland was not good. Had to have been the worst SU starting RB in my lifetime. In an ideal world he would have been nothing more than a 3rd down back. He wasn't good at running the ball but could pass block and catch.

 

[City of Cuse]

Strickland was not good. Had to have been the worst SU starting RB in my lifetime. In an ideal world he would have been nothing more than a 3rd down back. He wasn't good at running the ball but could pass block and catch.

That's crazy talk, dude had a sniff in the league.

 

[djorange1989]

trying to win but sucking > trying not to lose too badly and of course losing pretty badly

 

[City of Cuse]

This is am interesting question. Looking just at talent on the field right now, I'm not so sure we are in a better spot. Overall, I think Dino will get it done and improve next year, but man it's tough watching them right now.

 

[PAcuse]

I think people are way to stuck on last week and what we've seen this season.
If you can honestly look at the OVERALL football program and still think it's not way ahead where it was with FHCSS then I would suggest you go back and watch some of the games, pressers, and his antics vs Clemson.
Everything about this program is now better.

 

[TheCusian]

You can argue our talent is worse.

QB
Dungey so better then.

RB
Strickland and Neal. Slightly better now.

WR
Ish, Irv, Estime, Custis so better then.

TE
Nothing really there so worse then.

OL
Certainly was better then.

DL
Neither are good but I suppose Slayton puts them over the top.

LB
Bennett sand Franklin were really good. But there wasn't much there besides that. Our guys now are very young but they might be better. TBD.

DB
I think what we have now is better despite Frederick and Cordy, but we are very young.

K/P
We are better now despite Hof.

So I think the O talent was better when he took over. The D talent is better now. So a push?

This is a silly way of looking at it. Recruiting cycles, injuries, opt outs during a pandemic all make it moot.

I’d measure it by “what have you done” and “is there hope moving forward” ... and on both counts Dino trounces Shafer in his last season.

EDIT: The OP didn’t say *talent* it said program. In this case that gets you two different answers.

 

[HRE Otto IV]

That's crazy talk, dude had a sniff in the league.

Who is worse? At best he was the 2nd worst starting RB in the Carrier Dome era. IMO Neal was the 3rd worst.

 

[FloridaFan]

Strickland was not good. Had to have been the worst SU starting RB in my lifetime. In an ideal world he would have been nothing more than a 3rd down back. He wasn't good at running the ball but could pass block and catch.

The shclit coming out of your mouth is near slander

 

[HRE Otto IV]

The shclit coming out of your mouth is near slander

It should be easy then to prove me wrong. Name names?

 

[City of Cuse]

Who is worse? At best he was the 2nd worst starting RB in the Carrier Dome era. IMO Neal was the 3rd worst.

It's tough ranking solid rbs. Based on stats, he's pretty on par with several modern cuse rbs and better than some older dome era guys.
Moe is a great playmaker. He's closer to the middle/top than near the bottom.

 

[FloridaFan]

It should be easy then to prove me wrong. Name names?

Let’s start with Neal, you are telling me the 9th in career rushing yards here was the third worst RB since the dome opened? Keep in mind playing with dungey who ran the ball himself more often then not

 

[HRE Otto IV]

It's tough ranking solid rbs. Based on stats, he's pretty on par with several modern cuse rbs and better than some older dome era guys.
Moe is a great playmaker. He's closer to the middle/top than near the bottom.

His stats stunk so you lose that argument

 

[HRE Otto IV]

Let’s start with Neal, you are telling me the 9th in career rushing yards here was the third worst RB since the dome opened? Keep in mind playing with dungey who ran the ball himself more often then not

Are you 12? Have you never seen the RBs we have had? Neal was a great HR hitter. Which was great for this system and all those dives. You give him a crease and he could turn it into a big gain. He got through the hole quickly.

As an overall runner he was not good. He was not good in short yardage. He couldn’t get you the tough yards. He was not good at YAC. You was not good at getting those 3-4 yard gains that keep drives going. I can count on one hand the number of cuts he made here in his four years. He wasn’t good at making guys miss. He lacked vision. How many times did you see him run into the back of the OL when there was a hole in the next gap?

Neal IMO was a decent RB. The other RBs we have had were all decent to good. Some very good. We have been blessed with good RBs here.

 

[PAcuse]

His stats stunk so you lose that argument

Those stunk? Um ok

 

[Louie and Bouie]

We made it to the others considered in ESPN Bottom 10 this week. How many debate points is that worth?

Did we ever crack that wonderful list in 2015?

 

[HRE Otto IV]

View attachment 189802
Those stunk? Um ok

I was talking Strickland not Neal. But since you mention it those are only decent numbers for CFB. Neal was a decent overall RB. He was a great complimentary RB, and a good fit for Dino’s system. But IMO as a #1 he was sub par.

 

[City of Cuse]

His stats stunk so you lose that argument

Haha, I just looked them up. He averaged 4 yards a carry and 8 yards receiving (more like 7 due to an outlier in his freshman year).

Based on that he is on par with Curtis Brinkley.

Moe Neal averaged 5.3 yards a carry and almost 10 yards receiving.

He is on par with many of the top backs in program history based on that.

Stats don't tell the whole picture obviously, but these numbers arent awful. I will give you stricklands stats aren't super impressive, but give him some credit.

 

[PAcuse]

Who is worse? At best he was the 2nd worst starting RB in the Carrier Dome era. IMO Neal was the 3rd worst.

I was talking Strickland not Neal. But since you mention it those are only decent numbers for CFB. Neal was a decent overall RB. He was a great complimentary RB, and a good fit for Dino’s system. But IMO as a #1 he was sub par.

I mean you did bring up Mo's name, I got my wires crossed when you said his stats stunk.

 

[sufandu]

I mean you did bring up Mo's name, I got my wires crossed when you said his stats stunk.

One of his questions is interesting. How would we rank the starting RB's during the dome era?

 

[Chip]

Tucker is a natural RB, which is good. Early returns show him having the vision, patience, instincts for the position. Strickland, Neal, Jordan, all were/are guys that people thought should play in the slot at some point. No one says that about Tucker.

Strickland and Neal were fine. Not great, not bad. Did their jobs. Good blockers, knew the offense.

Tucker won't be confused with Adrian Peterson, but he looks like one of the lone bright spots in this year's offense. Excited about him for future years, and we'll have Hough next year too, who seems like a beast.

 

[HRE Otto IV]

Tucker is a natural RB, which is good. Early returns show him having the vision, patience, instincts for the position. Strickland, Neal, Jordan, all were/are guys that people thought should play in the slot at some point. No one says that about Tucker.

Strickland and Neal were fine. Not great, not bad. Did their jobs. Good blockers, knew the offense.

Tucker won't be confused with Adrian Peterson, but he looks like one of the lone bright spots in this year's offense. Excited about him for future years, and we'll have Hough next year too, who seems like a beast.

Excited about Tucker which is bad since we aren’t allowed nice things