ND/ACC finalizing rest of acc schedule

[rrlbees]

One fact that can't be denied is that the SU fan is secondary in almost every decision or deal that is made.

 

[Bayside44]

Good to know its pointless. Thanks for telling me a legit point isn't a legit one for me. It is not POINTLESS unless some asked Dr. Gross ON THE RECORD about this and tells us why it is the way it is. Then, once he said it one time people like me could even if we disagreed. When nothing is asked no accountability.

My god I am not demanding anything unreasonable and my points are all valid.

We play Notre Dame a bunch of times. We make money doing so. There cold be worse places to play, lots of schools play neutral site games.

You're acting like we are going to take the field with 9 players.

We've won on the road, lost badly at home, I don't see the big deal.

 

[Bayside44]

One fact that can't be denied is that the SU fan is secondary in almost every decision or deal that is made.

So moving to a better conference and having super inexpensive seats in huge parts of the stadium that is a great stadium for sightlines all screw you?

The one possible screwjob was USC, and coach punt-away would've had everyone going to the gates in the 3rd quarter.

 

[rrlbees]

So moving to a better conference and having super inexpensive seats in huge parts of the stadium that is a great stadium for sightlines all screw you? The one possible screwjob was USC, and coach punt-away would've had everyone going to the gates in the 3rd quarter.

Going to the ACC is much more than the football program. And the reason they have some cheap seats, which aren't that many nor good for most, is the result of everything.

 

[Alsacs]

A

We play Notre Dame a bunch of times. We make money doing so. There cold be worse places to play, lots of schools play neutral site games.

You're acting like we are going to take the field with 9 players.

We've won on the road, lost badly at home, I don't see the big deal.

Again ND is suppose to be an ACC partner. The deal is they will play 5 ACC teams a year. Why is Syracuse GETTING ZERO home games on campus while the other 13 teams will get that benefit. ND had games with ACC other than SU that were destroyed because of the 5 game ACC commitment. Syracuse didn't try or hasn't said if it tried to have the Metlife games scrapped or moved to the Dome. I am asking for some clarity on the matter. I am not asking for the Warren Commission to be declassified. If this were a profit share business I would be glad we are making money, but we are also losing money as well. Again, school play neutral site games NOT HOME GAMES turned into Neutral site games. Has anyone asked if ND will play its Home game in neutral field against SU? No, so ND gets to have its cake and eat it as well as Syracuse will go ND 2 times.

Yet, the same people are circling the wagons so nothing to see here or well. When Bees and I agree you know its something.

 

[KaiserUEO]

Listen, as I said to someone else in this thread your better off just ignoring this one as my points are legitiate and don't give me that excuse. Then why have the Pitt and BC games gone away because of the ACC-ND 5 game deal. Syracuse could have had atleast ONE of these TWO games go away, but ND probably loves the fact they are going to get 10-home games and only 5-road games.

Your a great partner ND. If ND were a partner they would have agreed to cancel the entire 4 game series and Syracuse could get their home games AT HOME. However, your going to spin and not just admit ND is giving it to SU.

you are ignoring the skin Giants Stadium has in this.

getting ND in NY is a home run for them.

giving the $$$ to Syracuse is a home run for Syracuse.

probably over a net million more than if at the Dome

25k season ticket holders lose.

thats a number i can sleep well with.

 

[rrlbees]

25k season ticket holders lose.

Exactly.

 

[Alsacs]

you are ignoring the skin Giants Stadium has in this.

getting ND in NY is a home run for them.

giving the $$$ to Syracuse is a home run for Syracuse.

probably over a net million more than if at the Dome

25k season ticket holders lose.

thats a number i can sleep well with.

Listen, if we want to play neutral site games like we did against Penn State fine. However, don't play home games at Metlife and road games at the opponent's home stadium. Its garbage.


Syracuse has played Michigan, Penn State, Tennessee, Auburn home/home since 1998 ONLY ONE TEAM got a 2 for 1 from us guess which one? Those so called partners from Notre Dame. I would rather not play Notre Dame then allow our football program to be treated like a mid-major. ND treats us like their female dog and we allow it. Better programs have played us evenly.

 

[Bayside44]

Going to the ACC is much more than the football program. And the reason they have some cheap seats, which aren't that many nor good for most, is the result of everything.

Those are club level for many other stadiums and cost gobs more. Heck I sat in club in FedEx and it was higher than just about anything at the Dome.

 

[Bayside44]

Listen, if we want to play neutral site games like we did against Penn State fine. However, don't play home games at Metlife and road games at the opponent's home stadium. Its garbage.


Syracuse has played Michigan, Penn State, Tennessee, Auburn home/home since 1998 ONLY ONE TEAM got a 2 for 1 from us guess which one? Those so called partners from Notre Dame. I would rather not play Notre Dame then allow our football program to be treated like a mid-major. ND treats us like their female dog and we allow it. Better programs have played us evenly.

So this is about hating Notre Dame then? Which is it?

Last I checked we won 2 of those 3 games - of course I went to the one we lost.

 

[Alsacs]

So this is about hating Notre Dame then? Which is it?

Last I checked we won 2 of those 3 games - of course I went to the one we lost.

I proving my point ND doesn't treat us well and we continue to allow it. Gross the second the 5 game/ACC deal was announced SHOULD have been on the phone with Metlife/ND and said those games are SU home games we now have leverage and want to reward our fans with home games.

Instead, we have no clue what the heck happened and have people like you telling me don't worry or care about it. If people PAY Syracuse for FOOTBALL GAMES AT THE DOME we should get games at the DOME. What benefit is the 5 game series with the ACC for Syracuse football fans?

 

[Alsacs]

I proving my point ND doesn't treat us well and we continue to allow it. Gross the second the 5 game/ACC deal was announced SHOULD have been on the phone with Metlife/ND and said those games are SU home games we now have leverage and want to reward our fans with home games.

Instead, we have no clue what the heck happened and have people like you telling me don't worry or care about it. If people PAY Syracuse for FOOTBALL GAMES AT THE DOME we should get games at the DOME. What benefit is the 5 game series with the ACC for Syracuse football fans?

What is two games that are suppose to be Syracuse home games 250 miles away, not part of the SU season ticket package, no economic benefit to CNY. Alex.


Yet, we have people who criticize local support. I bet we would get more fans from CNY to go watch ND at the Dome then will drive 250 miles away for a so called home game and be outnumbered 2-1.

 

[longtimefan]

I wasn't actually specifically saying you. I believe your fair and don't spin. I think your a straight shooter. This deal just shows me though SU is getting NOTHING from ND and nobody in the Syracuse media asks Gross about it. I do the three times I have seen Gross.

We should demand ND home BB games at MSG if they want to screw us like this.

So--if SU is one of the 5-game teams, and the remaining 3 break out as @ND, @the Dome, and @Met Life (as ND "Shamrock Series"), would you be satisfied?

 

[Alsacs]

So--if SU is one of the 5-game teams, and the remaining 3 break out as @ND, @the Dome, and @Met Life (as ND "Shamrock Series"), would you be satisfied?

100% be okay with this because atleast it would be 1-1-3 which is even. However, nobody in the Syracuse media asks Gross what is happening here.

However, ND has never treated SU FB well so I doubt they will now.

 

[Cheriehoop]

We play Notre Dame a bunch of times. We make money doing so. There cold be worse places to play, lots of schools play neutral site games.

You're acting like we are going to take the field with 9 players.

We've won on the road, lost badly at home, I don't see the big deal.

We lose alot of money also. We sold our most attractive opponents to "neutral" sites where the opponent would outdraw us and win each contest. Now we're spending money to try to attract the 5,550 additional fans we had averaged from 1990 through 2006 with freebies, discounts, package deals.

The only people who were hurt were the core loyal fans who attended every game at the dome through the dark times and were naive in believing that their faith would be rewarded when the team improved. This has been a multiple team deal over multiple years with ND being the worst offender. Wake Forest, Duke football etc never kowtowed to ND etc and their fans will reap the rewards we sold. ND won the negotiations with us and they will continue to for the unforeseen future through coaching and possibly AD changes. That's sad and sadder yet that some still believe that's the only way we can get high quality opponents to play us. With the LSU deal, I'd think some would realize that isn't true. If USC , Penn St, Alabama etc ever dreamed of playing us in basketball then I'd hope any high level negotiator would realize the leverage we have in helping continue re-establishing the respect the football team deserves.

 

[TexanMark]

you are ignoring the skin Giants Stadium has in this.

getting ND in NY is a home run for them.

giving the $$$ to Syracuse is a home run for Syracuse.

probably over a net million more than if at the Dome

25k season ticket holders lose.

thats a number i can sleep well with.

Basically this...when TGD agreed to this...we had no LSU h/h. No one was sure if all the P5 were going to 9 conference games. SU was in a tight spot with the MetLife contract. They needed teams to fulfill the agreement. Notre Dame was one of those teams that could help fill the stadium...really there are about 10-15 OOC teams we can get to play at MetLife and draw 55k+: ND, PSU, tOSU, Michigan, Rutgers, WVU, Bama, maybe Texas/OU/Tenn/Florida USC is TBD until they get back to being USC in the Top 5.

 

[TheCusian]

The truth is this: there is a list of things that are good reasons long-term for MetLife games and keeping the ND series there. The list of things that suck are basically short-term. Season ticket holders miss a quality home game and the team is at a small competitive disadvantage.

I'm betting if you were in Gross's shoes, looking at both lists - you go with the MetLife games.

 

[CU44SE]

Its quite simple and Alsacs refuses to acknowledge that we signed this contract in 2009. From an article,
"The deal between Syracuse University and MetLife Stadium, including the game against USC on Saturday and matchups with Notre Dame on Sept. 27, 2014, and Sept. 3, 2016, was announced in August 2009. Since then, Penn State has signed on to play Syracuse at MetLife Stadium in August 2013. And in March 2011, it was announced that the 82,566-capacity stadium will include 10 additional Syracuse football games to be scheduled between 2019 and 2038." A different article from Axe states,
"Games against Penn State in 2013 and Notre Dame in 2014 and 2016 are locked in. Ten more games beyond the year 2018 are also on tap." These games against Notre Dame were locked in long before we joined the ACC or they joined the ACC. We can't just throw away a contract, we would obviously have to pay a lot of money to get out of this contract. Money that we clearly don't have, and these games as much as we don't like them create a lot of money. It seems like we may be able to get out of the future games, the 10 that have not already been scheduled. But in two different articles it clearly states that these games were locked in. Its the only reason we are one of the only teams to get ND 2 times in there first 3 years in the ACC. Idk why you continue to look past these facts when you get on your high horse about these games. No one likes these games, I understand that. But we have a contract that was signed well before we got an invite from the ACC. These were locked in games.

 

[HtownOrange]

Alsacs, I love your passion for all things Orange. In this instance, Gross made a deal while we were a Big East team and needed the cash and exposure. We were getting very little of either in the Big East and the GRob era did not help. There was no ACC or B1G making serious overtures, while Rutgers, Louisville, WVU, Cincy, Pitt, USF and UConn were all looking elsewhere. Gross made a deal that benefited Syracuse. The deal is between THREE partners, not two! The games for 2014 and 2016 were scheduled before we received the ACC invite. In scheduling terms with ND and Giants Stadium (Yes, I am sticking it to the Jets), this is very short term and difficult to rearrange. Even if ND wanted to reschedule the 2016 game, the Meadowlands would have a say in the matter. They cannot simply replace a big name draw like ND. It was simply better for all parties to accept that ND would get two games v. Syracuse in the Meadowlands than to create other issues that may delay or bar ND from partnering with the ACC, cost more money to get out of than it is worth the trouble of doing so.

Benefits:
Play a Major team
Play in NYC (O.K., technically in NJ, but it is the Meadowlands)
Get a nice payout from said stadium
National exposure
Sticking it to Rutgers
Sticking it to B1G
Play in front of Alumni base in the NYC area
Great for area recruits (hoops, football and lacrosse)

Losses:
Lose big name game in Dome
Loss of Dome revenue/concessions/parking
Local fans cannot attend (as if the yard work would disappear)

I want these games in the Dome, too. However, there simply isn't enough reason to cause the problems and hassles necessary to cancel the ND games.

As for the longer term deal with the Meadowlands, who says Gross is not working to revamp the deal? Even then, the Meadowlands is responsible to place a name team in there for one off games which Syracuse may work into 1-1-1s. I f this is so, what is the harm?

Michigan Alabama, USC, ND, etc., etc. are playing in these neutral site games and making money. Gross did the same for Syracuse. No one is claiming this is perfect, but certainly better than what we had in the Big East.

 

[Alsacs]

We lose alot of money also. We sold our most attractive opponents to "neutral" sites where the opponent would outdraw us and win each contest. Now we're spending money to try to attract the 5,550 additional fans we had averaged from 1990 through 2006 with freebies, discounts, package deals.

The only people who were hurt were the core loyal fans who attended every game at the dome through the dark times and were naive in believing that their faith would be rewarded when the team improved. This has been a multiple team deal over multiple years with ND being the worst offender. Wake Forest, Duke football etc never kowtowed to ND etc and their fans will reap the rewards we sold. ND won the negotiations with us and they will continue to for the unforeseen future through coaching and possibly AD changes. That's sad and sadder yet that some still believe that's the only way we can get high quality opponents to play us. With the LSU deal, I'd think some would realize that isn't true. If USC , Penn St, Alabama etc ever dreamed of playing us in basketball then I'd hope any high level negotiator would realize the leverage we have in helping continue re-establishing the respect the football team deserves.

My god I couldn't have said it any better. Thank you

 

[Alsacs]

The truth is this: there is a list of things that are good reasons long-term for MetLife games and keeping the ND series there. The list of things that suck are basically short-term. Season ticket holders miss a quality home game and the team is at a small competitive disadvantage.

I'm betting if you were in Gross's shoes, looking at both lists - you go with the MetLife games.

Actually no I wouldn't if I cared about my fanbase or I would atleast try to get one of the games moved back to the Dome instead of screwing his fanbase up the wazoo. SU FB fans will see absolutely no benefit to ND playing 5 ACC games that is a fact based on what we know right now.

 

[TheCusian]

If the concern were solely being able to get the best teams to play us - then those days are behind us. The playoff and establishment of the p5 made scheduling us much more attractive no matter we play. See: LSU.

 

[Alsacs]

Its quite simple and Alsacs refuses to acknowledge that we signed this contract in 2009. From an article,
"The deal between Syracuse University and MetLife Stadium, including the game against USC on Saturday and matchups with Notre Dame on Sept. 27, 2014, and Sept. 3, 2016, was announced in August 2009. Since then, Penn State has signed on to play Syracuse at MetLife Stadium in August 2013. And in March 2011, it was announced that the 82,566-capacity stadium will include 10 additional Syracuse football games to be scheduled between 2019 and 2038." A different article from Axe states,
"Games against Penn State in 2013 and Notre Dame in 2014 and 2016 are locked in. Ten more games beyond the year 2018 are also on tap." These games against Notre Dame were locked in long before we joined the ACC or they joined the ACC. We can't just throw away a contract, we would obviously have to pay a lot of money to get out of this contract. Money that we clearly don't have, and these games as much as we don't like them create a lot of money. It seems like we may be able to get out of the future games, the 10 that have not already been scheduled. But in two different articles it clearly states that these games were locked in. Its the only reason we are one of the only teams to get ND 2 times in there first 3 years in the ACC. Idk why you continue to look past these facts when you get on your high horse about these games. No one likes these games, I understand that. But we have a contract that was signed well before we got an invite from the ACC. These were locked in games.

Your a lawyer. Syracuse could have repudiated that contract the second we joined the ACC. These games being locked in are crap. That game last year was technically a B1G game they had the contract on the Penn State game.

What damages do Metlife suffer? If they paid a a signing bonus you return it and move on. Facts are simple ND has stuck it on us. Pitt and BC had games with ND as well both of them just got rid of them. Getting out of a contract isn't that hard if the non-breaching party isn't suffering anything but nominal damages.[/QUOTE]

 

[Alsacs]

Alsacs, I love your passion for all things Orange. In this instance, Gross made a deal while we were a Big East team and needed the cash and exposure. We were getting very little of either in the Big East and the GRob era did not help. There was no ACC or B1G making serious overtures, while Rutgers, Louisville, WVU, Cincy, Pitt, USF and UConn were all looking elsewhere. Gross made a deal that benefited Syracuse. The deal is between THREE partners, not two! The games for 2014 and 2016 were scheduled before we received the ACC invite. In scheduling terms with ND and Giants Stadium (Yes, I am sticking it to the Jets), this is very short term and difficult to rearrange. Even if ND wanted to reschedule the 2016 game, the Meadowlands would have a say in the matter. They cannot simply replace a big name draw like ND. It was simply better for all parties to accept that ND would get two games v. Syracuse in the Meadowlands than to create other issues that may delay or bar ND from partnering with the ACC, cost more money to get out of than it is worth the trouble of doing so.

Benefits:
Play a Major team
Play in NYC (O.K., technically in NJ, but it is the Meadowlands)
Get a nice payout from said stadium
National exposure
Sticking it to Rutgers
Sticking it to B1G
Play in front of Alumni base in the NYC area
Great for area recruits (hoops, football and lacrosse)

Losses:
Lose big name game in Dome
Loss of Dome revenue/concessions/parking
Local fans cannot attend (as if the yard work would disappear)

I want these games in the Dome, too. However, there simply isn't enough reason to cause the problems and hassles necessary to cancel the ND games.

As for the longer term deal with the Meadowlands, who says Gross is not working to revamp the deal? Even then, the Meadowlands is responsible to place a name team in there for one off games which Syracuse may work into 1-1-1s. I f this is so, what is the harm?

Michigan Alabama, USC, ND, etc., etc. are playing in these neutral site games and making money. Gross did the same for Syracuse. No one is claiming this is perfect, but certainly better than what we had in the Big East.

If Notre Dame is a party to this Metlife contract then Gross is even an bigger idiot.

Here is the conservation Notre Dame had "UConn, Syracuse, Rutgers we want to play you guys but only if you come to South Bend and agree to play your home games at Metlife." UConn we wish we could but our state legislature won't let us, Rutgers no play us at home, Syracuse okay. Syracuse then agreed with Metlife on the dates. If ND was a party to that contract that would imply they control the gate or get more when all they are visitors.

 

[TheCusian]

Actually no I wouldn't if I cared about my fanbase or I would atleast try to get one of the games moved back to the Dome instead of screwing his fanbase up the wazoo. SU FB fans will see absolutely no benefit to ND playing 5 ACC games that is a fact based on what we know right now.

So money in the coffers has no long-term benefits to the fans? Screwing the local fan base to move games closer to alumni who live downstate, many of which make tons more money than upstate fans?

This "no benefit" crusade you've been on is a little much.