So we missed a couple recruits | Page 3 | Syracusefan.com

So we missed a couple recruits

I think it's hard to argue that the recruiting hasn't dipped and that there is at least some cause to worry.

I am somewhat reassured by remembering that we had the same concerns in the 98-01 period and again 05-08ish and that the recruiting recovered both times.

This time may be different. But there is at least some historical reason for confidence it can be turned around.
 
It's frustrating to acknowledge, but I do think ND is trending up, and they've been winning some key recruiting battles this cycle. However, these things tend to be cyclical. JB has a proven track record. Over the years, he has brought Cuse back to the top again after a year or two of mediocrity, and I'm hopeful he can do it again.
To Brey's credit, he hasn't had to deal with sanctions. Nor anything close to that. We have been hurt by a number of things as of late. The sanctions did what they were intended to do. Our head coach got very, very complacent. And there was dysfunction in our coaching staff with the change afoot and the head guy not wanting to go. Some of that is behind us.
 
I think it's hard to argue that the recruiting hasn't dipped and that there is at least some cause to worry.

I am somewhat reassured by remembering that we had the same concerns in the 98-01 period and again 05-08ish and that the recruiting recovered both times.

This time may be different. But there is at least some historical reason for confidence it can be turned around.

But JB was a Spring Chicken back in 98-01 and a fall one in 05-08. Now, that chicken can barely cluck. ;):p
 
I hope so and I'm glad to hear you say that.

You can get a little jaded living in SEC country, in close proximity to Clemson and Tobacco Road.

I know we'll never be able to throw around Football money like a UGA or Clemson but one would hope we'll be able to stay on par with our peer teams in the Northeast and the tier below FSU/Miami/Clemson in the ACC.

Basketball worries me when it seems a done deal that we won't pay to bring in a big time coach after JB. If we're willing to bring in an up and comer while seriously improving facilities, I can live with that.
I hear you about the SEC money. Living in this part of the world you're reminded of it on a regular basis.

It does come back to bite the fans though. Local paper said that the cheapest Clemson tickets this fall will be $171. Basketball, not so much even though they have a totally renovated facility as of last year.
 
I hear you about the SEC money. Living in this part of the world you're reminded of it on a regular basis.

It does come back to bite the fans though. Local paper said that the cheapest Clemson tickets this fall will be $171. Basketball, not so much even though they have a totally renovated facility as of last year.

The cheapest ticket is 171, that can't be, you mean a nosebleed seat for an fcs opponent is 171?
 
The cheapest ticket is 171, that can't be, you mean a nosebleed seat for an fcs opponent is 171?
Just quoting the paper.

I'm quite sure they are talking individual game tickets. Season ticket would not be that much for the average seat.

Having said that, Clemson fans are among the most rabid after the successful years they have had.
 
Some people bought final four tickets and plane tickets for our team last year and we were lucky to have a winning record. I'll take NDs flame out over our season last year.

You're 100% right, nobody can make an argument over the careers of the two coaches which is why in saying the trend. Notre Dame stock would be going up and SU stock would be going down and I'm not sure that even is a debate.
But 2-3, although we tanked last year and have had some difficulties due to sanctions, on paper we still had as much potential as we've had in years. ND did only SLIGHTLY better (getting into the tournament and exiting early), and they didn't lose 3 guys from their front line (including both centers) with season-ending injuries. That was the reason behind last year's failure -- not some precipitous dip in our talent pool or coaching.
 
Last edited:
Brissett's criminally underrated. Don't expect him to average double figures but people need to stop looking at star and top 100 rankings and watch game tape.
.[/QUOTE

Every year somebody says somebody is vastly underrated. Last year it was Moyer. And he redshirted. Chuhwu was going to surprise. Any more surprises like these and it'll be a disappointing season.
 
Moyer was hurt, come on.
Moyer was hurt. DC2, our presumptive starting center and low-post scorer (the first one we've had since Arinze/Ricky) couldn't even run up and down the court by Christmas. And then Chuku -- our 7'2" savior on the glass -- couldn't even see. He played 7 games. How many teams could overcome injuries on that scale, save UNC/Duke? To my mind, it wasn't talent or coaching that doomed us last year. It was injuries to both centers and a backup forward ... that decimated our front line.
 
I honestly don't remember anyone saying that Moyer was going to surprise last year. We had White and Robey at the 3 and 4 and Lydon appeared that he would play some 4 as well becasue we had PC and Coleman. Not to mention Thompson. who was talking about Moyer. The kid was injured before he even got here.
 
Like MASH guy said, it's about the guards. I recall the second half of the Eighties when SU was stacked with big guys, but transfers by Michael Brown, Earl Duncan, etc., forced SU to groom people like Stevie Thompson to heave 3 pointers all summer in practice to hopefully compensate. If only Adrian Autry had been a year or 2 older...
 
Brissett's criminally underrated. Don't expect him to average double figures but people need to stop looking at star and top 100 rankings and watch game tape.

We have a solid team going into this year, and the future looks bright despite some recruitment misses. I love the class we have coming in and domino's will fall for '18, the years still young.

People who are doom n gloomin with limited to no evidence are as good as bandwagon fans to me. I certainly see why many die hards are skeptical and justifiably worried, but I also see a lot of good that a lot of people are allowing to be overshadowed.

We aren't Kansas, Duke, UK, UNC, UA, UCLA or whatever blue blood. WE NEVER HAVE BEEN. Missing out on recruits early in the process isn't the end of the world.

Much truth to what you have said here...BUT, after several seasons where we ostensibly had a shot at winning it all many fans were entertaining the notion that we were, in fact, nudging our way into Blue Blood territory. The injury to Arinze and then the Fab Melo conflagration followed by the culmination of the 10 year witch hunt and NCAA and subsequent sanctions was then followed by the unexpected and untimely departures of some kids who we assumed would have a little bit of a longer tenure on the hill.

The atmosphere of uncertainty with JB supposedly retiring and now the departure of Hop added yet another component of anti-recruiting ju-ju. All of this in my opinion has led to emergence of fan-fatigue... and the perennial conjecture that "we are on the precipice of having a great team". When you consider how things unfolded last year it's no wonder that many fans are entertaining unprecedented levels of doubt and questioning the future of the program. Many die hard fans sat on the edge of our seats waiting out the Andrew White sweepstakes and lest we not forget how many here were heralding last years team (JB included in this posse) as perhaps the best to ever take the floor for the Orange. We all know how that turned out. But hey, happens and I think we all get that. More importantly, what I'm speaking to is the fan fatigue which has set in and a general malaise which has arisen as we watch the program whiff on top player after top player.

Missing out on top 50 guys happens all the time. I get that. But when viewed in conjunction with all of the things I have mentioned above it takes on a different complexion. Simply said, it would be less than truthful to say that we haven't lost some of the shine that the program once had. There is no denying the fact that we have been unable to get the top kids to put on Orange. There is really no disputing that. It is a fact and as hard as it is to swallow... in the end... it's fact.

Many will counter with the fact that we have never had a steady flow of top 50 kids and JB has a rep for doing more with diamonds in the rough who have flown under the radar and JB has a knack for finding. Again, all true but at the same time we more often than not had one really good kid coming in with each class.

Any honest self appraisal of the team and the program would also have to acknowledge the fact that the mystique that was once associated with the Dome is not what it once was. Programs which enjoy new venues with a more intimate setting can land big time kids by also providing them with enhanced living facilities with all the creature comforts wanted by the coddled to players of the current day.

The successful programs of the next decade will put effort into making their programs the kind of place that kids want to go to where they can be lavished with a ridiculous level of amenities and a place that seemingly " all the other good kids want to go there too". With the break up of the Big East and the emergence of super luxury digs for players at other places Syracuse is faced with the problem of putting some shine back into the prospect of playing at Syracuse. The old paradigm no longer works.
Do kids want to come play in a cavernous domed football facility with a blue curtain and an aged curmudgeon coach who can be acerbic and grumpy and... well, downright nasty during pressers, and for a team which has struggled to win a post season conference game and has failed to make the dance recently?

I love JB and respect all that he has accomplished both on and off the court. There can be no understating his importance to the program and college basketball in general but I have mixed feelings that perhaps we have missed the opportunity to get a jump start in remolding the program so as to be competitive in what has become a very much changed college basketball landscape.
Hop may not have been the answer but he would have been the natural answer to bridging and honoring the tradition of the programs past while also looking toward a new more youthful and invigorated future and put a face of enthusiasm which might attract today's top recruits.

In the end... you have got to have good players. Top level players. There is a lot which goes into the formula for building and maintaining a successful program. But without a steady diet of at least a few top level players... you are playing for runner up and "only if" status. Face it. Top players attract more top players. And when you ain't gettin' any.

well,...then you ain't gettin' any. And we all know how much that sucks.
 
Last edited:
Too much emphasis on numbers, and stars. OB is top 50. Marek, we will never know what he would be ranked had he played in the states. I'd guess pretty well. HW, we even beat out that damn Brey and Jay Wright for. Sid, who had 20 offers from good schools. Since everyone loves numbers, and all that. Oh yeah, Moyer. Top 75 kid with big offers, and a red shirt year under his belt, and people think we can't recruit.
 
Brissett's criminally underrated. Don't expect him to average double figures but people need to stop looking at star and top 100 rankings and watch game tape.

We have a solid team going into this year, and the future looks bright despite some recruitment misses. I love the class we have coming in and domino's will fall for '18, the years still young.

People who are doom n gloomin with limited to no evidence are as good as bandwagon fans to me. I certainly see why many die hards are skeptical and justifiably worried, but I also see a lot of good that a lot of people are allowing to be overshadowed.

We aren't Kansas, Duke, UK, UNC, UA, UCLA or whatever blue blood. WE NEVER HAVE BEEN. Missing out on recruits early in the process isn't the end of the world.
Thats BS. We are and have always been an elite program. After uk and duke we have had the best run of 1st round picks. Think big be big. If Dino can recruit on a national basis why not jb. Hop stevie both came from the west coast. We used to own Philly. JB needs to look at his staff and in the mirror. One more crap year and its time for his going away party.
 
Too much emphasis on numbers, and stars. OB is top 50. Marek, we will never know what he would be ranked had he played in the states. I'd guess pretty well. HW, we even beat out that damn Brey and Jay Wright for. Sid, who had 20 offers from good schools. Since everyone loves numbers, and all that. Oh yeah, Moyer. Top 75 kid with big offers, and a red shirt year under his belt, and people think we can't recruit.

When did we beat out Villanova and Notre Dame for Howard Washington?
 
I honestly don't remember anyone saying that Moyer was going to surprise last year. We had White and Robey at the 3 and 4 and Lydon appeared that he would play some 4 as well becasue we had PC and Coleman. Not to mention Thompson. who was talking about Moyer. The kid was injured before he even got here.
When Moyer was recruited, some where saying "he`s going to surprise a lot of people. Before White was sigened and he was a candidate for playing time, that continued. It wasn't until White came on board, that it stopped. Cho was claimed to a defensive stalwart. Evev in preseason, that wasn't apparent. Just saying. Its said every year with not much coming true.
 
When Moyer was recruited, some where saying "he`s going to surprise a lot of people. Before White was sigened and he was a candidate for playing time, that continued. It wasn't until White came on board, that it stopped. Cho was claimed to a defensive stalwart. Evev in preseason, that wasn't apparent. Just saying. Its said every year with not much coming true.
Said every year with not much coming true. Funny, I think we have had a pretty successful basketball run for the last 40+ years. A lot of it just had to have come true.
 
Brissett's criminally underrated. Don't expect him to average double figures but people need to stop looking at star and top 100 rankings and watch game tape.

We have a solid team going into this year, and the future looks bright despite some recruitment misses. I love the class we have coming in and domino's will fall for '18, the years still young.

People who are doom n gloomin with limited to no evidence are as good as bandwagon fans to me. I certainly see why many die hards are skeptical and justifiably worried, but I also see a lot of good that a lot of people are allowing to be overshadowed.

We aren't Kansas, Duke, UK, UNC, UA, UCLA or whatever blue blood. WE NEVER HAVE BEEN. Missing out on recruits early in the process isn't the end of the world.
We are an elite program. Arizona? UCLA? Cmon on.

Syracuse basketball is a top 10-12 program alltime.

Our recruiting needs to pick back up.
 
Too much emphasis on numbers, and stars. OB is top 50. Marek, we will never know what he would be ranked had he played in the states. I'd guess pretty well. HW, we even beat out that damn Brey and Jay Wright for. Sid, who had 20 offers from good schools. Since everyone loves numbers, and all that. Oh yeah, Moyer. Top 75 kid with big offers, and a red shirt year under his belt, and people think we can't recruit.
Neither Nova nor Notre D ever offered HW.
 
Moyer was hurt. DC2, our presumptive starting center and low-postmake scorer (the first one we've had since Arinze/Ricky) couldn't even run up and down the court by Christmas. And then Chuku -- our 7'2" savior on the glass -- couldn't even see. He played 7 games. How many teams could overcome injuries on that scale, save UNC/Duke? To my mind, it wasn't talent or coaching that doomed us last year. It was injuries to both centers and a backup forward ... that decimated our front line.

DC2 being hurt was not a surprise. Don't think anyone realistically expected much production from him last year. Chukwu played enough to make me concerned about what kind of production we will get from him this year. Injuries did not do in last year's team - it was just a bad mix.
 
Moyer was hurt. DC2, our presumptive starting center and low-post scorer (the first one we've had since Arinze/Ricky) couldn't even run up and down the court by Christmas. And then Chuku -- our 7'2" savior on the glass -- couldn't even see. He played 7 games. How many teams could overcome injuries on that scale, save UNC/Duke? To my mind, it wasn't talent or coaching that doomed us last year. It was injuries to both centers and a backup forward ... that decimated our front line.

even if those guys weren't injured, they were not going to contribute jack squat offensively.
 
How is redshirting disappointing? It was the smart decision?
 

Forum statistics

Threads
167,628
Messages
4,717,172
Members
5,909
Latest member
jc824

Online statistics

Members online
273
Guests online
2,516
Total visitors
2,789


Top Bottom