The DeVito catharsis thread

[cuseincincy]

Why do we have to tip toe around TD? He came here and had very little success. Wyoming was like playing a 7v 7 which what Tommy has always excelled at. He had very few decisions to make yesterday which is where he did not excel in the past. Since he is a transfer can we now say out loud that Tommy always had a reputation to not be able able to handle pressure. Even in high school. Enjoy it while he can because the B10 will make his line look nothing like the "quality o line" some are drooling over because of how they looked against Wyoming.

 

[rrlbees]

Given their schedule he should do well those 1st four games. After that it looks like it will all be downhill. Yesterday was the 2nd easiest game on their schedule and his rating/qbr were below what he averaged in 2019. So with a record setting bad OL he still put up better numbers than he did yesterday against a G5 school. Chances are his numbers will get worse being that 10 of the next 11 are against P5 schools. He definitely will not get sacked as much, but you won't win many games passing the ball 5 yards every play and his stats will be worse than they were in 2019.



Edit

The coaches will stick by Tommy all year long but I would not be surprised if during their bye week before Nebraska, the fans are questioning if Sitkowski should start that game.

His PFF grade yesterday was 78.4. 2019 was 58.4. And yesterday Illinois was playing “small ball” which supposedly is the MO of the new OC. I’m sure if more deep passes were called Tommy would have been more than happy to wing it.

 

[Frozen]

Tommy would have been more than happy to wing it.

 

[OttoinGrotto]

For those that don’t know, Will Leitch founded Deadspin and is an Illinois alum.

I knew he was the Deadspin guy, didn't realize he went to Illinois.

 

[OttoinGrotto]

I don’t think TD is smart enough to run a complicated offense, especially under pressure. People at his HS didn’t think he was very smart. “Dumb as rocks” was one descriptive quote.
I’ve never shared that out of respect but considering we’re not taking shots now…

Am I fair to say that?

Was it cathartic saying that?

If so, it's the DeVito catharsis thread, so you're all good.

 

[Capt. Tuttle]

He had plenty of uninjured games and was an "Elite 11" QB that was schooled by countless private coaches and lived QB1 since he was a baby.
Bad Apples to Oranges

Shift the ground rules much. The issue is performances at SU under SU coaching and with SU talent.
Shrader was an SEC recruit out of HS, so his upside would appear better at the outset.

 

[sufandu]

Yes and then he changes to something else. Father keeper or something

He was caretaker first then came back as redrum after a break from the board.

 

[SWC75]

I think why it may seem some people are “rooting” against Tommy is because if he goes to Illinois and has an amazing season it’s going to make a lot of us question, what the heck was going on here? Is it Dino Babers and co? It’ll also make a lot of us question if we made the right move with Shrader…

So I don’t think it’s that they are rooting against TD, I think it’s more…..don’t want to be wrong about him not being that great and that we are actually better off without him than with him

We care how those who left or could have come here until their position is adequately filled. Shrader had an interesting year last year but he needs to drastically improve his passing, (with the help of his line, his receivers and Coach Beck), to be adequate and when that happens, we'll cease to be any more than curious about what Tommy does. Until then, the QB battle is still taking place in our minds.

I recall a stat Brent Axe cited, (but cannot find the article at the moment), that Tommy was the most accurate passer in the nation in 2019 on passes of more than 40 yards. He doesn't have to be a 'dink and dunk' guy. Here are Tommy's yard per completion and yards per attempt over his career:

2018 11.9/6.0
2019 11.1/7.0
2020 12.3/6.2
2021 12.1/7.5
2022 7.3/5.3

I thought we'd see a trend of him become gun-shy due to the sacks but that really didn't happen. I think the one game this year is a result of a conservative offense with a new QB throwing to receivers new to him against an over-matched opponent. I think Tommy still wants to throw deep and he'll get the chance to do so as the season progresses. The question is: as the defensive pressure increases will we see his tendency to give up on plays too early re-assert itself? Or will they simply resort to the conservative passing attack we just saw to compensate. And if Shrader is tearing it up here, will we care?

 

[sufandu]

I don’t think TD is smart enough to run a complicated offense, especially under pressure. People at his HS didn’t think he was very smart. “Dumb as rocks” was one descriptive quote.
I’ve never shared that out of respect but considering we’re not taking shots now…

Am I fair to say that?

I don't think it has anything to do with intelligence. It's feel and instincts. Some people have it others don't. I have always lacked instincts and it's made me a step slower than I otherwise would be.

 

[OrangeTarheel]

I remember getting frustrated that TD wouldn’t look at next level receivers - I imagine the passes he connected on were his first option.

I can’t remember TD giving up his body for a play ever - and Shredder did that twice last year in big games (Clemson, VTech) that put us in a position to win or tie.

Obviously two unrelated things, this thread has opened up some wounds. I may need therapy

 

[sufandu]

I remember getting frustrated that TD wouldn’t look at next level receivers - I imagine the passes he connected on were his first option.

I can’t remember TD giving up his body for a play ever - and Shredder did that twice last year in big games (Clemson, VTech) that put us in a position to win or tie.

Obviously two unrelated things, this thread has opened up some wounds. I may need therapy

I don't doubt his injuries, so I believe he gave up his body plenty. He's just not dynamic with his feet so it doesn't feel that way. I won't criticize his effort or willingness to fight for his team. I just think he lacks immeasurables that keep him from being more than average.

 

[djorange1989]

We didn’t give Tommy much to work with here, but when you look at his sacks per dropback vs. our other QBs, it looks really bad for him. And with the exception of Western Michigan in 2019 I don’t remember him having a great game as a starter against a half decent team, it was usually padding stats in blowout losses. It has been mentioned numerous times but some guys just don’t have IT, he is one of those guys.

 

[bigmike]

I’m glad that TD can only play one more season or this string might get as long as the Rutgers Dumpster Fire.

 

[orangenauburn]

I don't doubt his injuries, so I believe he gave up his body plenty. He's just not dynamic with his feet so it doesn't feel that way. I won't criticize his effort or willingness to fight for his team. I just think he lacks immeasurables that keep him from being more than average.

I 100% believe he was sore. You don't take that many hits without feeling it at some point.

Most hits were not his fault. Others were. Part of being QB

 

[sufandu]

We didn’t give Tommy much to work with here, but when you look at his sacks per dropback vs. our other QBs, it looks really bad for him. And with the exception of Western Michigan in 2019 I don’t remember him having a great game as a starter against a half decent team, it was usually padding stats in blowout losses. It has been mentioned numerous times but some guys just don’t have IT, he is one of those guys.

We didn't give a lot to work with but last year he had the same team around him as Shrader did last year. And the team looked different with Shrader on the field. We need our QB to be a playmaker, not just run an offense. Anytime we've been good that's what we've had. It just didn't work out that the guy with the golden arm was also a playmaker.

 

[OttoinGrotto]

I’m glad that TD can only play one more season or this string might get as long as the Rutgers Dumpster Fire.

 

[Orangeman]

Huh?

Pre-emptive, they were not beating the spread and Devito was throwing ducks at the time I posted this.

Thankfully the narrative turned around (for Tommy and my bet)

 

[HRE Otto IV]

We didn't give a lot to work with but last year he had the same team around him as Shrader did last year. And the team looked different with Shrader on the field. We need our QB to be a playmaker, not just run an offense. Anytime we've been good that's what we've had. It just didn't work out that the guy with the golden arm was also a playmaker.

Shrader also did not have Taj after the Liberty game.

 

[GoSU96]

Shrader also did not have Taj after the Liberty game.

you mean the receiver that coughed it up at the five after a first down completion and dropped a 40 yd completion that was a potential TD in the same game.

guy.

 

[PAcuse]

Shift the ground rules much. The issue is performances at SU under SU coaching and with SU talent.
Shrader was an SEC recruit out of HS, so his upside would appear better at the outset.

I didn’t shift anything?
I was merely stating facts.
Just because Shrader went to the SEC does not make him the better recruit, flawed logic.
One was an elite 11 QB that was trained to be the second coming of Brady.
One was recruited by the SEC.
Anyway both have preformed poorly has passers under SU.
Tommy had a very average game against a terrible team.
Let’s see what Shrader does now that he has a real OC and QB coach.

 

[TheCusian]

I’m not sure why people can’t understand this. He left the team mid year. Had something not so nice to say when he left.

And if he does great at Illinois it makes our coaches look bad. Making many of us asking why it didn’t work here. So yes, people want him to stink because then clearly it means it wasn’t the coaches.

I don't think it's that simple at all (though, I think some may try to run with this).

There are a lot of variables - who we played each of the 3 years, who they play this year, OL play, WR talent, system, philosophy, etc. The stuff that is unlikely to change is: great arm, bad under pressure, safe decision making - all of which showed up yesterday. After 3Q vs Wyoming he had a very Syracuse 2021 yds/comp

It's easier to say: he got every chance we could provide here, and then he went there and did x without drawing any real conclusions. I know we won't do that, but...

 

[rrlbees]

We didn’t give Tommy much to work with here, but when you look at his sacks per dropback vs. our other QBs, it looks really bad for him. And with the exception of Western Michigan in 2019 I don’t remember him having a great game as a starter against a half decent team, it was usually padding stats in blowout losses. It has been mentioned numerous times but some guys just don’t have IT, he is one of those guys.

Not counting the past two seasons when he only played 3 and 4 games, in 2019 when he played a full season, Tommy dropped back 428 times and was sacked 46 times. A 10.74 rate. Last season Shredder dropped back 308 times and was sacked 33 times. A 10.71 rate.

 

[djorange1989]

Not counting the past two seasons when he only played 3 and 4 games, in 2019 when he played a full season, Tommy dropped back 428 times and was sacked 46 times. A 10.74 rate. Last season Shredder dropped back 308 times and was sacked 33 times. A 10.71 rate.

Hey don’t ruin my rant with your facts

 

[HRE Otto IV]

Not counting the past two seasons when he only played 3 and 4 games, in 2019 when he played a full season, Tommy dropped back 428 times and was sacked 46 times. A 10.74 rate. Last season Shredder dropped back 308 times and was sacked 33 times. A 10.71 rate.

That seems way off. How did TD have 428 drop backs? And wasn't he sacked only 44 times? Where do you get the 33 and 308 for Shrader? By my count TD was 8.65 overall and 6.21 vs the P5. Shrader was 10 overall and 9.08 vs the P5.

 

[kcsu]

use guys need to give it up.