BJ getting pulled after a minute

[xc84]

You said this, "Maybe because he does 10x more positive and also impacts the ability of others to get open looks?"

I missed hitting it verbatim, but I was close. This was in response to BJ getting pulled quickly after one mistake versus Cooney making many.



I don't care what any coach allegedly says. I know what I see. His stat line was awful against UNC. 28 points on 26 FGA when he isn't our best player is outrageous. That isn't even counting him barely contributing boards or assists since he was in the whole game. That also isn't counting his poor defensive lapses and his long boards leading to breaks coming from his ridiculous shots against a team that runs. And his decision making with shooting isn't isolated to this game.

I guarantee any coach we have yet to play would take that stat line over and over if it could be guaranteed. It's inefficient, detrimental to the betterment of the team and takes possessions away from our best player, who is Rak. Rak is vying to be an All American. TC isn't even remotely in that conversation.

I think TC is a good player, but that was a bad game. He is not nearly good enough to pull possessions from Rak.

For the year he has 257 FGA and 309 points. Rakeem has 249 FGA and 387 points. eFG%, which accounts for the value of 3 pointers v. 2 pointers, is 49% to 59%. True Shooting %, Win Shares, etc. I can go on and on. They all say the same thing. Our not-best-player accounted for more than double the shots than our best player. It's either bad coaching or bad decision making by TC or both. I don't care how many HoF responses I get from posting this.

I'd love to hear all these coaches who are gushing about TC who aren't counting their lucky stars that TC is taking more shots than Rak. Does he have an imapct on the game? Sure. Everyone that plays does. But that is a cop out when discussing this.

Cooney took no shots away from Christmas. Christmas struggled in the first half and Cooney picked up the slack...and probably helped ease the congestion in the middle for Christmas. Cooney carried the team in the first half. Saying Cooney has a bad game is nuts. It wasn't great...but it was pretty good. He was 10-26 but 3 were 3's. He had 24 points off FGs which would equate to 12 2 pointers. Essentially, it is the equivalent of 12-26 from 2 which is 46%. He was also 4-4 FTs. Sorry, that's not inefficient.

 

[MikeSU02]

Cooney took no shots away from Christmas. Christmas struggled in the first half and Cooney picked up the slack...and probably helped ease the congestion in the middle for Christmas. Cooney carried the team in the first half. Saying Cooney has a bad game is nuts. It wasn't great...but it was pretty good. He was 10-26 but 3 were 3's. He had 24 points off FGs which would equate to 12 2 pointers. Essentially, it is the equivalent of 12-26 from 2 which is 46%. He was also 4-4 FTs. Sorry, that's not inefficient.

We have a fundamental difference in how we measure a good game.

Happy to agree to disagree.

 

[SaltLakeOrange]

It's not that strange. Cooney was a weapon last night. When you are your team's main weapon and play 40 minutes, you are going to be forgiven a few mistakes. You can't seriously compare Cooney v. Patterson or Johnson. I am not down on them...but they need to step it up and I think they have the talent to do so. Boeheim showed he still had confidence in Patterson at the end of the game... probably because the guy shows up in practice.

Johnson isn't close to ready. Patterson is THIS CLOSE to being there. Those shots will start falling soon. He's playing good defense and hustles his ass off. That said, I would not be surprised if neither is around next year...

 

[SaltLakeOrange]

28 pts on 26 FGA? 38% shooting for the game from the floor? 2 boards, 1 assist, 2 steals and 3 TOs? Sinking way too low when the ball goes inside? All those off balance/fade away shots giving way to long rebounds against a team that loves to run?

TC is a good player for us. He is not 10x better than anyone right now, however.

He's a good player.

Not counting RAK and MG, who's better?

 

[SaltLakeOrange]

We have a fundamental difference in how we measure a good game.

Happy to agree to disagree.

We didn't lose Monday because of offense...to think so is wrong. Trevor had a great first half and RAK had a great second half. We lost because UNC shot lights out and was too tough on the offensive glass...

Against Miami we lost at the FT line...RAK and Cooney both had solid games.

Bottom line is we don't win ANY games unless both play well AND others pick up the slack...but they are our two most important players period...

 

[MikeSU02]

Not counting RAK and MG, who's better?

It's not just about who is better (but I agree with your choices), but how much better.

I would say TC and MG are pretty close in talent.

Rak, to me, is leaps and bounds better than either.

And a dominant center in the college game is a very rare talent to have.

 

[MikeSU02]

We didn't lose Monday because of offense...to think so is wrong. Trevor had a great first half and RAK had a great second half. We lost because UNC shot lights out and was too tough on the offensive glass...

Against Miami we lost at the FT line...RAK and Cooney both had solid games.

Bottom line is we don't win ANY games unless both play well AND others pick up the slack...but they are our two most important players period...

We can agree to disagree. Nothing happens in a vacuum. There are added benefits to going inside early and often and working inside out when you have a talented big.

We disagree, but I respect your opinion. I just don't think it's accurate from my standpoint.

 

[CorduroyG]

The difference is JB doesn't have the luxury to yank BJ after 30 seconds. We literally have zero depth if BJ doesn't play. I'd much rather BJ and buss play through some mistakes even if it costs us a few points if it means our starters are gonna be fresher down the stretch and able to finish out games better.

 

[CuseFaninVT]

We can agree to disagree. Nothing happens in a vacuum. There are added benefits to going inside early and often and working inside out when you have a talented big.

We disagree, but I respect your opinion. I just don't think it's accurate from my standpoint.

I'm with you on this one. We feed the post more often and those bigs for UNC get into even more foul trouble. Those bigs sit on the sidelines and G and Roberson aren't giving up offense rebounds and giving the guards for UNC even more opportunities to make 3 pointers. Just one little scenario that I could imagine.

 

[jgeorge322]

10x the negative things he does.

As to last night, it was not an easy task getting Rak the ball. It's why he was 1-5 the first half. You must think you can just toss it in there at anytime.

honestly, i think rak would get worn down if we went to him even more. we have to spread it out somewhat. doesn't rak have a couple of nagging injuries as well? he cant be 100% with the minutes hes playing.

 

[CuseFaninVT]

honestly, i think rak would get worn down if we went to him even more. we have to spread it out somewhat. doesn't rak have a couple of nagging injuries as well? he cant be 100% with the minutes hes playing.

There is definitely potential for overuse, but then again, he's working EVERY single play to establish the position, might as well reward him when he gets that perfect seal. And he had it a couple times and was missed by his teammates, including Cooney on at least one occasion. And he looked better than everyone else when that game was done. He's simply a beast this year, despite being the only real big and battling plantar fasciitis.

 

[jgeorge322]

There is definitely potential for overuse, but then again, he's working EVERY single play to establish the position, might as well reward him when he gets that perfect seal. And he had it a couple times and was missed by his teammates, including Cooney on at least one occasion. And he looked better than everyone else when that game was done. He's simply a beast this year, despite being the only real big and battling plantar fasciitis.

we all agree kid is playing at an unbelievable level. i mean truly astonishing. im too young to remember dc and seikaly. my earliest memory of a big is mcrae. but i put this year for him as top of any su big in my memory.

 

[sabach]

You should edit your post and write "Obama is the greatest President ever" so it looks like Millhouse liked that.

I just started reading this thread. I read VT's post and ask myself "what the heck does President Obama have to do with this?" Now I see why that line is there. Lol

 

[kirbivore]

That's strange...Cooney can make enough mistakes to account for an ESPN top 10 bloopers segment and still stay in the game. Just sayin'

He's entered the Wallace, GMAC, and Warrick zone where he can do whatever he wants and not get benched.

 

[Brooky03]

That's strange...Cooney can make enough mistakes to account for an ESPN top 10 bloopers segment and still stay in the game. Just sayin'

Cooney could also knock down 3 straight three-pointers before the defense blinks. Joesph, Patterson, and BJ can't do that. Cooney at his worst is better than the alternative. Cooney with one leg is probably better than the alternative.

 

[oddo033]

Cooney could also knock down 3 straight three-pointers before the defense blinks. Joesph, Patterson, and BJ can't do that. Cooney at his worst is better than the alternative. Cooney with one leg is probably better than the alternative.

Cooney is also the only real outside threat beside G. When he is out of the game the opposition could literally form a box around Rak and keep someone near G to stop the whole team. We only have three people who can consistently score (Roberson is making strides though) we have no other guards who can consistently hit outside shots, or midrange, or layups...

GMAC was anything but efficient his last couple of years. He was our best threat though. So we lived and died by him.

 

[SUbear]

It doesn't seem like bobbling a ball has anything to do with learning though. If he's missing assignments, going to the wrong spots on offense, not shifting properly or identifying shooters on defense that's one thing. If he's playing tight because he knows he's gonna get pulled that's another. Look at TR. JB has no choice but to play him and we can see progress nearly every game. The "he's not learning" line is used too much by JB in my opinion.

"BJ when are you gonna learn how to not bobble the ball!?!?"

He was not pulled for the bobble, he was pulled because he was not playing defense.

 

[sufandu]

He was not pulled for the bobble, he was pulled because he was not playing defense.

How much defense did he not play in less than one minute? Yell at him as he comes back down court. If he fails to make the adjustment in another couple of possessions, pull him then.

 

[SUbear]

How much defense did he not play in less than one minute? Yell at him as he comes back down court. If he fails to make the adjustment in another couple of possessions, pull him then.

If a player does not follow instructions he was given bfore entering the game, he gets pulled, no point in further discussion with said player.

 

[djcon57]

Cooney could also knock down 3 straight three-pointers before the defense blinks. Joesph, Patterson, and BJ can't do that. Cooney at his worst is better than the alternative. Cooney with one leg is probably better than the alternative.

Nice of you to bash our other players.

Is Cooney at 100% better or worse than Cooney at 75% for 35 mins and 5 mins of Patterson/BJ/Joseph?

Why do Lebron/Curry/Durant etc not play the whole game in the NBA?

 

[xc84]

Nice of you to bash our other players.

Is Cooney at 100% better or worse than Cooney at 75% for 35 mins and 5 mins of Patterson/BJ/Joseph?

Why do Lebron/Curry/Durant etc not play the whole game in the NBA?

So far, 5 minutes of Patterson has not helped the team. Joseph is much different...he play a lot...is a PG... and is not a replacement for Cooney. When BJ and Patterson start making shots and reduce mistakes, I am sure Boeheim would love to use them to spell Cooney.

 

[sufandu]

If a player does not follow instructions he was given bfore entering the game, he gets pulled, no point in further discussion with said player.

If people were robots I'd agree with you, but they're not. The speed of a game is different than practice. When a guy is overwhelmed because he doesn't get the chance to ever adjust to game speed he's going to make mistakes. And when a guy is thinking instead of reacting, again because he almost never plays, he's going to be slower getting into position or shifting or covering. We only need to look at Roberson as a guy that has grown this year when JB was forced to play him more. He's not the first and he won't be the last.

 

[djcon57]

So far, 5 minutes of Patterson has not helped the team. Joseph is much different...he play a lot...is a PG... and is not a replacement for Cooney. When BJ and Patterson start making shots and reduce mistakes, I am sure Boeheim would love to use them to spell Cooney.

Play a lineup of Patterson/G/BJ/Roberson/Rak

Note: WE ARE ALREADY LOSING. To say we "can't" do something is ridiculous. A loss is a loss.

 

[xc84]

Play a lineup of Patterson/G/BJ/Roberson/Rak

Note: WE ARE ALREADY LOSING. To say we "can't" do something is ridiculous. A loss is a loss.

We were winning.
Boeheim sees them in practice too. Gotta play the players who give you the best chance to win.

I didn't say they "can't do something".

Let's talk about Christian White. Why not play him over Cooney?

 

[djcon57]

We were winning.
Boeheim sees them in practice too. Gotta play the players who give you the best chance to win.

I didn't say they "can't do something".

Agreed...and 30-35 Mins of Rak and Cooney are the players that give you best chance to win.