NBA Thread 2022-23 Season

[cliftonparksufan]

This made me actually laugh out loud, from a Jazz forum I check once in a while:

View attachment 219415

I'm surprised Cavs went for this deal unless they are able to extend Mitchell. Ainge pulled off two great trades and he's not done yet. Curious how patient Jazz fans will be. It's a mother lode but a lot will have to fall in place for them to compete for an NBA championship. They should have money for free agency but realistically who would sign to play in Utah.

 

[jncuse]

First off, Garland's contract is fantastic. He's going to be a steal at $18M.

Second, the Jazz aren't done as they'll ship out their other vets for more picks and young guys.

Third, I wonder if they could have gotten this deal without the Gobert trade. Let's say this deal happens first. A starting five of Conley-Sexton-Bogdanovic-Markkinen-Gobert... that's a squad. That team could be really good. Still flawed, but that's a playoff team.

1. Regarding Garland's contract -- he is still on his rookie contract at $9 million this year. He is never at $18M though. Next year his 5 yr / $193M contract extension kicks in. ($38m / year - which is fine for a player of his quality in the current NBA Cap world)

Garland / Mitchell / Mobley / Allen is a fine core that Cleveland controls for a while. And there owner is not one that is afraid of the lux tax if need be.

2. Regarding the Jazz trades - I agree. Going to be many Royce O'Neal type trades. They are going to flip value / sell cap space for the next few years at least like an OKC. They got such a good head start by trading players at their peak. They are going to have an even bigger mountain of picks.

3. I'm not as high on Sexton / Markannen, so in the loaded up west, I would think that lineup is contending for 9-11 spots in the race -- of course there are always injuries to other teams so maybe a spot higher. As an outsider anyway, I think the Jazz went the right way to avoid a re-tool.

Sexton is an interesting player. Not sure if Ainge sees him as a risk that has potential to be an asset with the Jazz or a while. Or a risk, that has potential to put up big scoring numbers on a weak Jazz team and is then flippable.

 

[jncuse]

I'm surprised Cavs went for this deal unless they are able to extend Mitchell. Ainge pulled off two great trades and he's not done yet. Curious how patient Jazz fans will be. It's a mother lode but a lot will have to fall in place for them to compete for an NBA championship. They should have money for free agency but realistically who would sign to play in Utah.

The model for them I think will be like what OKC will do. Pain for at least a few years.

Draft one or two elite players (and get other solid youth through the draft)
Use excess draft picks, other good young players, to trade for a star level player (or two) at the right time.

The easy part is accumulating assets via trades. Moulding a team is the harder part.

Philly is good, but are they really a championship contender? They are at a point that they need to rely heavily on an aging Harden to take them to that next level -- and I am skeptical of that.

 

[jncuse]

I'm surprised Cavs went for this deal unless they are able to extend Mitchell. Ainge pulled off two great trades and he's not done yet. Curious how patient Jazz fans will be. It's a mother lode but a lot will have to fall in place for them to compete for an NBA championship. They should have money for free agency but realistically who would sign to play in Utah.

Cleveland will have control over him for the next 3 years. I don't even think they are permitted to offer an extension for at least a few years.

 

[jncuse]

Fluck everyone.

I hope he doesn’t go.

Fluck the jazz.

Fluck ainge.

Fluck the cavs.

And Fluck you, yeah you….meaning anyone who isn’t as mad as me.

Whether it is management or ownership incompetence or just plain bad luck, things almost never seem to work out for the Knicks.

On the Raptors board I post on, we simply describe it as "LOL Knicks" when things go bad. Sorry, don't mean to rub it in to Knicks fans here -- it can't be easy for passionate fans for things to always seem to go bad.

 

[OttoinGrotto]

1. Regarding Garland's contract -- he is still on his rookie contract at $9 million this year. He is never at $18M though. Next year his 5 yr / $193M contract extension kicks in. ($38m / year - which is fine for a player of his quality in the current NBA Cap world)

Garland / Mitchell / Mobley / Allen is a fine core that Cleveland controls for a while. And there owner is not one that is afraid of the lux tax if need be.

2. Regarding the Jazz trades - I agree. Going to be many Royce O'Neal type trades. They are going to flip value / sell cap space for the next few years at least like an OKC. They got such a good head start by trading players at their peak. They are going to have an even bigger mountain of picks.

3. I'm not as high on Sexton / Markannen, so in the loaded up west, I would think that lineup is contending for 9-11 spots in the race -- of course there are always injuries to other teams so maybe a spot higher. As an outsider anyway, I think the Jazz went the right way to avoid a re-tool.

Sexton is an interesting player. Not sure if Ainge sees him as a risk that has potential to be an asset with the Jazz or a while. Or a risk, that has potential to put up big scoring numbers on a weak Jazz team and is then flippable.

I meant Sexton, not Garland. My bad. Sexton's contract is 4/72.

 

[chugg21]

If they gel together well, Garland and Mitchell will soon be the NBA’s best backcourt.

I don't think they'll get there unless Mitchell stops being a traffic cone. He has crazy length for a small guard but he's so bad on that end. Maybe now with another high level playmaker next to him he can conserve some energy on that end.

 

[OttoinGrotto]

The model for them I think will be like what OKC will do. Pain for at least a few years.

Draft one or two elite players (and get other solid youth through the draft)
Use excess draft picks, other good young players, to trade for a star level player (or two) at the right time.

The easy part is accumulating assets via trades. Moulding a team is the harder part.

Philly is good, but are they really a championship contender? They are at a point that they need to rely heavily on an aging Harden to take them to that next level -- and I am skeptical of that.

Jazz will go full tank for the 23 draft, and will also want to semitank for the 24 draft - they keep their pick that year if it's 1-10.

 

[OttoinGrotto]

I don't think they'll get there unless Mitchell stops being a traffic cone. He has crazy length for a small guard but he's so bad on that end. Maybe now with another high level playmaker next to him he can conserve some energy on that end.

It's all just desire for Mitchell. There's no reason for him to be a bad defender. Physically and athletically he could be a terror.

 

[KaiserUEO]

Whether it is management or ownership incompetence or just plain bad luck, things almost never seem to work out for the Knicks.

On the Raptors board I post on, we simply describe it as "LOL Knicks" when things go bad. Sorry, don't mean to rub it in to Knicks fans here -- it can't be easy for passionate fans for things to always seem to go bad.

Ohhh….the PAIN!!!!!

 

[jncuse]

I meant Sexton, not Garland. My bad. Sexton's contract is 4/72.

They were easy to confuse for a while.

 

[ScrabbCuse]

Whether it is management or ownership incompetence or just plain bad luck, things almost never seem to work out for the Knicks.

On the Raptors board I post on, we simply describe it as "LOL Knicks" when things go bad. Sorry, don't mean to rub it in to Knicks fans here -- it can't be easy for passionate fans for things to always seem to go bad.

The LOL Knicks is well deserved for all the blunders they have made over the years. One day when the Knicks win the title, whether it be 5, 10, 50 or 100 years from now, the Knick fans will have earned the right to laugh loudly in the face of every other opposing fan for at least a year. We will be the most insufferable winners you will ever see and it will be well deserved for the absolute torture us fans have had to go through with this mess of a franchise.

 

[Orangezoo]

The LOL Knicks is well deserved for all the blunders they have made over the years. One day when the Knicks win the title, whether it be 5, 10, 50 or 100 years from now, the Knick fans will have earned the right to laugh loudly in the face of every other opposing fan for at least a year. We will be the most insufferable winners you will ever see and it will be well deserved for the absolute torture us fans have had to go through with this mess of a franchise.

It's turned me into a passive fan at best not ashamed to admit it. Just so little reason to care that much anymore with literally any short term success nothing but fools gold.

 

[cliftonparksufan]

1. Regarding Garland's contract -- he is still on his rookie contract at $9 million this year. He is never at $18M though. Next year his 5 yr / $193M contract extension kicks in. ($38m / year - which is fine for a player of his quality in the current NBA Cap world)

Garland / Mitchell / Mobley / Allen is a fine core that Cleveland controls for a while. And there owner is not one that is afraid of the lux tax if need be.

2. Regarding the Jazz trades - I agree. Going to be many Royce O'Neal type trades. They are going to flip value / sell cap space for the next few years at least like an OKC. They got such a good head start by trading players at their peak. They are going to have an even bigger mountain of picks.

3. I'm not as high on Sexton / Markannen, so in the loaded up west, I would think that lineup is contending for 9-11 spots in the race -- of course there are always injuries to other teams so maybe a spot higher. As an outsider anyway, I think the Jazz went the right way to avoid a re-tool.

Sexton is an interesting player. Not sure if Ainge sees him as a risk that has potential to be an asset with the Jazz or a while. Or a risk, that has potential to put up big scoring numbers on a weak Jazz team and is then flippable.

Sexton definitely has talent. His 3rd year stats are similar to Mitchell. What the Jazz do with him is the question. This could be an all-time trade in favor of the Jazz depending on how the draft picks shake out.

 

[OttoinGrotto]

Sexton definitely has talent. His 3rd year stats are similar to Mitchell. What the Jazz do with him is the question. This could be an all-time trade in favor of the Jazz depending on how the draft picks shake out.

One of the things I like... the Jazz made deals with small market teams that decided to go all chips in.

Love it. Two teams needed elite talent to make the leap. They got it.

 

[Fireball Jr.]

 

[Knicks411]

I'm fine with the Knicks missing out on Mitchell. I wanted them to hold the line on 2 unprotected ones and they did. Where do they go from here? Great question. But Mitchell wasn't going to put them over the top and they basically had to pay that kind of price to get him. So this is not a lol knicks thing for me at all.

I also really see it for Cleveland. They're a lot closer and they aren't in a destination location so maybe you have to spend just a little more to make a deal happen. They do need a 3, but their top 4 guys are really good. The Garland/Mitchell backcourt could be an issue defensively (they're both short, same thing a lot of Knicks fans talked about with Brunson and Mitchell) but Allen and Mobley on the back end helps out a lot.

 

[Fireball Jr.]

Sheeeeeeeeeit!

 

[MikeSU02]

Trade is good for CLE. For a team and city that has basically only had their one chip in '16, this gets them right into the discussion for the 4/5 seed moving forward in the east. And, depending on how the team gels and how Mobley grows, could be even higher. Bos/Mil/Phi (if they don't lose their minds) should stick in the top three. I think Miami falls back to the 4/5 range.

Utah has a ways to go. Just grin and bear it. Lots of picks, you'll have enough shots to get a good player in the draft.

I don't mind the Knicks not getting Mitchell, but the fact of the matter is the CAA connection hasn't come to fruition. We're in purgatory right now. We're not nearly bad enough to be vying for a top 3 pick, but we aren't good enough to have any sort of a shot of getting out of the first round, at the very best. I don't even know if we get in.

 

[jncuse]

We're not nearly bad enough to be vying for a top 3 pick, but we aren't good enough to have any sort of a shot of getting out of the first round, at the very best. I don't even know if we get in.

The East isn't necessarily stacked, but its not easy to get in the playoffs either.
I have 9 teams above the Knicks right now (but certainly 1 or 2 will fall due to injuries and drama) - I'm sure they get in the play in, but I don't think they have a great chance at the top 6 to avoid the play-in.

Bos / Mil / Phi
Miami / Brook / Clev
Tor / Chi / Atl
NYK

I see Miami / Brooklyn potentially going either way -- combination of age and drama.

 

[OttoinGrotto]

Trade is good for CLE. For a team and city that has basically only had their one chip in '16, this gets them right into the discussion for the 4/5 seed moving forward in the east. And, depending on how the team gels and how Mobley grows, could be even higher. Bos/Mil/Phi (if they don't lose their minds) should stick in the top three. I think Miami falls back to the 4/5 range.

Utah has a ways to go. Just grin and bear it. Lots of picks, you'll have enough shots to get a good player in the draft.

I don't mind the Knicks not getting Mitchell, but the fact of the matter is the CAA connection hasn't come to fruition. We're in purgatory right now. We're not nearly bad enough to be vying for a top 3 pick, but we aren't good enough to have any sort of a shot of getting out of the first round, at the very best. I don't even know if we get in.

Smart Jazz fans are thrilled to be rebuilding.

Sentimental Jazz fans are sad to see Gobert and Mitchell go.

 

[cliftonparksufan]

Smart Jazz fans are thrilled to be rebuilding.

Sentimental Jazz fans are sad to see Gobert and Mitchell go.

How about Jazz fans over 60 years old? I'm definitely sad but I do like Sexton and Maarkenen. Will be sad when Clarkson gets traded. Especially if it's to the Lakers.

 

[OttoinGrotto]

How about Jazz fans over 60 years old? I'm definitely sad but I do like Sexton and Maarkenen. Will be sad when Clarkson gets traded. Especially if it's to the Lakers.

I'm bummed to see Rudy go but if there was a way to do it, this was it.

Definitely will be interesting to watch how long it takes to strip the rest of the roster off for parts to contenders.

 

[Madbiker]

I don't see how giving up Barrett, Quickley, and more plus 3 of their own unprotected #1's plus another #1 they acquired for Mitchell could possibly make the Knicks better. Mitchell is a really good scorer but he's one guy. Opening up other holes plus giving away a ton of future draft capital just made no sense. which is why these talks went nowhere for many many weeks. The trade makes sense for Cleveland because they are not giving up any of their 3 best players. They had surplus talent to trade. Unlike the Knicks who don't and would have just robbed Peter to pay Paul. On to the next hot thing.

 

[OttoinGrotto]

I don't see how giving up Barrett, Quickley, and more plus 3 of their own unprotected #1's plus another #1 they acquired for Mitchell could possibly make the Knicks better. Mitchell is a really good scorer but he's one guy. Opening up other holes plus giving away a ton of future draft capital just made no sense. which is why these talks went nowhere for many many weeks. The trade makes sense for Cleveland because they are not giving up any of their 3 best players. They had surplus talent to trade. Unlike the Knicks who don't and would have just robbed Peter to pay Paul. On to the next hot thing.

Where the Knicks are in a tough spot is when the next hot thing comes around, what are they going to do if they didn't make a move this time?